Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses • Hacker News Board

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#41

Post by throwawaygh » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:08 PM UTC

googthrowaway42 wrote: post #19

People have gotten stupider because the world is too complex (and fundamentally impossible) to understand in a completely rational way. Historically we have relied upon intuition, heuristics, and a network of trusted authority figures (usually a network of trusted institutions). The modern condition (post Enlightenment) can be understood as the elevation of rationality over all else and hostility towards heuristics a…

So your world view is that Harvard professors are eveil and stupid, NY Times reporters are evil and stupid, most modern people are stupid, software engineers are stupid, PhDs are stupid, doctors are stupid, lawyers are stupid, no one has taken advice from their grandmother since 1785, and no one reads the Bible anymore.

Is it possible that becoming an MD might require a base level of mental capabilities and hard work? Is it possible that becoming a Harvard professor in their Math or CS department requires a big helping of skill, work, and luck? Is it possible that passing the Bar exam requires, if not a genius intellect, at least a base level of intellectual capability? Is it possible that all these people you disparage are actually just normal humans doing a pretty decent job at playing a small productive role in running society?

More importantly: do you feel this way about the actual people that surround you -- your significant other, your in-laws, your old school friends, your coworkers, etc.? If so, please talk with a therapist (or your grandmother) about these feelings. This isn't meant in any way as an attack or belittlement. It's meant as genuine advice. Feeling like everyone around you is evil and stupid isn't healthy.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#42

Post by grenoire » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:08 PM UTC

TallGuyShort wrote: post #32

I've engaged a few flat earthers to actually listen to their arguments and show them my own evidence that it's real (locating amateur radio satellites using data shared by people around the globe and demonstrating the doppler effect on them). The response strikes me as being indicative of mental illness. And I don't mean that as an insult - I mean that when confronted with that they're clearly irrational. And somethi…

I think there is too much information around for the average person to filter and process and digest. All three are important parts of living in a society and it looks to me like even with e.g. economic issues alone, it's just very hard for (to be fair) anybody to keep up.

In turn, people reach out to conspiracy theories to simplify the world around them with obvious answers and explanations.

My theory, sort of.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#43

Post by mattigames » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:09 PM UTC

The most likely culprit for me is that a lot of gullible people weren't exposed to so many stupid ideas before internet which also gave them a quick and easy tool to share them (and therefore amplifying their reach), so their numbers can quickly increase and be louder than ever before in human history.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#44

Post by ngngngng » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:09 PM UTC

irrational wrote: post #34

Flankk wrote: post #7

> I am acquiring greater wisdom with age as I ought, but the average age of the typical person I encounter stays the same so they cannot keep up. I’m noticing the contrast increasing but misattributing it. My money is on this. You wouldn't typically argue with a kid, but on the internet you probably are.

That is one thing that frustrates me on discussion boards. You have no idea who is behind the nickname. Is this an adult with a college degree, corporate job, kids, mortgage, etc.? Or is this a 12 year old masquerading as someone older? Sometimes people argue against things that seem so obvious as an adult that I really really want to know who is on the other side.

This is perhaps why we see spelling and grammar called out so often on the internet. We're trying to lift the veil the fiber cables put in front of our eyes and reveal the idiot on the other end, but there's not much to go off of and we cling to whatever evidence we can.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#45

Post by cblconfederate » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:09 PM UTC

I m entertaining the idea that it is indeed expanding. Well not expanding , but that intelligence is regressing to the mean which is equally bad. People thrive under constraints and struggle. It's what makes games fun to play. Maybe the ease of modern life makes humans complacent. I mean i can't explain why i see so many people struggle when they use an old computer program which used to be commonplace in its day/ observing them shows a clear laziness to do deep-thinking. I m afraid i m becoming one of them too -- the horror!

I can't help but think that we 're lacking the genius giants for which the last century is notorious. Where are the kolmogorovs, the von neumanns, the einsteins, the fred sangers of the past ~40 years? Is there a big gap in the higher end of intelligence? What about the lower end of intelligence? If both are lacking that means we are indeed regressing to become average idiots.

I like to think we already live in idiocracy. People forget however that in that movie, the biggest idiot wasnt President Camacho, it was the people, the way-below-average joes, who are evenly distributed across the political spectrum. (In fact the blind belief that politics alone can bring progress is kind of dumb in itself). Could it be something in the way we eat? There is a well established and colossal drop in testosterone levels in the past ~50 years. After all we are just neurochemical intelligence generators.

(Also why is everyone focusing on social media? That's just a symptom)

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#46

Post by forinti » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:09 PM UTC

Flankk wrote: post #7

> I am acquiring greater wisdom with age as I ought, but the average age of the typical person I encounter stays the same so they cannot keep up. I’m noticing the contrast increasing but misattributing it. My money is on this. You wouldn't typically argue with a kid, but on the internet you probably are.

I've noticed older people near me just weren't prepared for all the silliness on the internet.

You have to coach them into being more critical of what they read online.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#47

Post by Sohcahtoa82 » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:09 PM UTC

wobbegongz wrote: post #37

In the past people believed in lots of stupid things like "god exists", "the poor deserves its situation and the rich has earned its situation", "hatred toward blacks, Jews, neighbor country, homosexuals, handicapped and many more", "kings are good and democracy bad", "the strong country has a right to invade the week country", "the rich are evil and the poor saints" and so one. So I think the idea that stupidity has…

> "the strong country has a right to invade the week country"

Indeed they do.

But not the month country. I mean, maybe they have the right to, but it'd be foolish. And invading the year country would be outright suicide.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#48

Post by k0mplex » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:10 PM UTC

grenoire wrote: post #42

TallGuyShort wrote: post #32

I've engaged a few flat earthers to actually listen to their arguments and show them my own evidence that it's real (locating amateur radio satellites using data shared by people around the globe and demonstrating the doppler effect on them). The response strikes me as being indicative of mental illness. And I don't mean that as an insult - I mean that when confronted with that they're clearly irrational. And somethi…

I think there is too much information around for the average person to filter and process and digest. All three are important parts of living in a society and it looks to me like even with e.g. economic issues alone, it's just very hard for (to be fair) anybody to keep up. In turn, people reach out to conspiracy theories to simplify the world around them with obvious answers and explanations. My theory, sort of.

this makes a lot of sense

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#49

Post by phkahler » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:10 PM UTC

Flankk wrote: post #7

> I am acquiring greater wisdom with age as I ought, but the average age of the typical person I encounter stays the same so they cannot keep up. I’m noticing the contrast increasing but misattributing it. My money is on this. You wouldn't typically argue with a kid, but on the internet you probably are.

Definitely to some degree. I see younger people learning lessons that I learned 20 years ago right here on HN. It's not that they are stupid, ignorant, or didnt get the memo way back then. It's that learning is a life long adventure and they aren't as far along yet. Ok, so they did just get the memo but because they were 5 when I read it, and it's been around far longer than that.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#50

Post by prox » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:10 PM UTC

nicetryguy wrote: post #26

scotty79 wrote: post #11

Maybe stupidity is just entertaining and gets promoted because of that? As I watch another flat earth debunking video suggested by youtube to have a laugh I'm wondering ... Am I the part of the problem? How popular stupidity would be without people pointing fingers at stupidity and laughing?

> As I watch another flat earth debunking video suggested by youtube to have a laugh I'm wondering ... Am I the part of the problem? I feel the same way. It seems sites like reddit have taken a sharp turn towards pointing out "stupidity" to briefly secure some fleeting sense of mental superiority. I find it mean spirited. It's strange how the zeitgeist of CURRENT_YEAR is fighting both for hyper political correctness…

This line of reasoning has always felt as dishonest. The arguments you mention where all the hype ten years ago.

For instance, hyper political correctness always has ment a double speak word to me for “I want to be racist / misogynistic, but they don’t let me”

It’s not about mental superiority, imo it is about turning around polarization and hyperbole.

If you’re happen to be “mentally unfortunate” as you put it, I don’t see any lambasting going on. Feel free to give examples.

Edit : for clarity