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Privacy is the most important concept of our time

inre.me

41–50 of 226 posts

Re: Privacy is the most important concept of our time

#41

This seems unpersuasive to me. I mean, privacy is good, sure, I agree with that much. But it's trying to pin too much on one concept. For example, this is a big part of the thesis: > A clear example of the loss of privacy is the rise of violent rethoric. And I think that's pretty clearly disproved by the fact that violent rhetoric is almost always deployed in closed, "private" communities. The more closed, the more v…

The thesis is pretty weak. Image boards can be visited by everyone and there are no membership cards. There isn't anything more public than that.

If you think of stormfront when talking about privacy, you seem to have learned that from pretty strange sources.

"Privacy cloisters extremism" is a pretty insane statement to be honest.

Re: Privacy is the most important concept of our time

#42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fwiw - these two things are not as disentangled as one might think. Consider disinformation leading to the widespread climate change deniers. Both are existential threats with high degrees of uncertainty.

How is disinformation entangled with privacy?

Off the top of my head:

- It could be in the interest of a government to make sure people aren't spreading what they would consider disinformation

- It is then in the government's interest to prevent the spread of disinformation, perhaps to identify those spreading it or those who may be inclined to spread it

- It's not a stretch then to consider that it could be in the interest of government, particularly one with malicious or authoritarian intent, to tap into private conversations of people suspected of spreading disinformation.

I find it particularly concerning, because I assume that what people within a society would consider disinformation is 1) inconsistent, 2) ephemeral.

Re: Privacy is the most important concept of our time

#43

Not destroying our planet with GHG and rendering it inhospitable for millions of species, including humanity, is more important than a couple generations' data being spied on.

If governments become authoritarian enough because they know exactly who went to protests, there won't be any climate change protests.

Re: Privacy is the most important concept of our time

#44
post #36

I don't get the link between privacy and freedom of speech. I can have private thoughts and private behaviors that don't necessarily have to do with speaking . In fact, many aspects of privacy have to do with what one does and thinks and not with what one says . Or freedom of speech is related to privacy (by the author) in a way that I can surely upload a video to Youtube telling that my neighbor cheats his wife beca…

I might have been unclear on this aspect. My point was that privacy can affect other rights in complex ways, including, as a way of example, freedom of speech.

In the example I was talking about in the article, I was trying to say that nowadays people have different norms and opinions on what is fair. That is great, however this means that without privacy I can hurt you simply by sharing something about you with a a certain community. For instance, I can take something you said in private, or one fact about you (i.e., you are a member of party X, or have a certain sexuality, or belong to a certain religion) and share with a community that will misinterpret or attack you for that.

In the past we allowed the press to violate privacy of important people for something nefarious (i.e., they hunt people for sport). Now everybody has the power to violate privacy of anybody for any reason they see fit.

So, now maybe we should forbid everyone to violate the privacy of anyone, otherwise we will lose freedom of speech, because will be afraid to say anything for fear of being taken out of context. Maybe we should all agree that if you disagree with somebody you cannot call a mob to defend your opinion, but you should call them with your speech. That is not an obvious choice to make. As others have commented, what about actually powerful people? Just disagreeing with them will not change their opinion, because they are more powerful than you. So, I am not saying that is easy to understand what to do, but that privacy can actually change how we use other rights.

Re: Privacy is the most important concept of our time

#47
post #36

I don't get the link between privacy and freedom of speech. I can have private thoughts and private behaviors that don't necessarily have to do with speaking . In fact, many aspects of privacy have to do with what one does and thinks and not with what one says . Or freedom of speech is related to privacy (by the author) in a way that I can surely upload a video to Youtube telling that my neighbor cheats his wife beca…

Various acquaintances have told me they are keeping quiet about things they believe because they don’t want their opinions to be held against them in future by anyone with a search engine.

Sometimes they’re quiet online about their sexuality, or that they are trans; sometimes it is about politics; sometimes it is about religion; sometimes drug use or attitudes about legalisation.

They all talked to me about those things IRL, but the lack of privacy online means they can’t comfortably reach out online to others in the same position as themselves.

Re: Privacy is the most important concept of our time

#48

Not destroying our planet with GHG and rendering it inhospitable for millions of species, including humanity, is more important than a couple generations' data being spied on.

Climate change is a slow process. Technology is fast enough to catch up with it and solve it, since it's mostly a technological problem.

Privacy is a social problem. Automation is too(And my guess in the near future, it would be a much bigger problem).

Social problems get resolved very slowly, if at all. So those 2 seem more worrysome.

Re: Privacy is the most important concept of our time

#50
post #48

Not destroying our planet with GHG and rendering it inhospitable for millions of species, including humanity, is more important than a couple generations' data being spied on.

Climate change is a slow process. Technology is fast enough to catch up with it and solve it, since it's mostly a technological problem. Privacy is a social problem. Automation is too(And my guess in the near future, it would be a much bigger problem). Social problems get resolved very slowly, if at all. So those 2 seem more worrysome.

Anyone who believes the above simply hasn't looked at the numbers. The speed at which we need to reduce emissions simply dwarfs anything technology has ever achieved - not to mention the fact that so far, technological progress has always had the net effect of adding to GHG emissions.

Let's take the example of the digital industry. Arguably, it's shown the most impressive trajectory of energy efficiency, with an exponential growth sustained over many decades, roughly gaining 3 orders of magnitude every 16 years (See Koomey's law: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koomey%27s_law#:~:text=Koomey'....).

But overall, what's the currently worst-offending industry in terms of GHG emissions / energy consumption growth? The digital industry! Our unmoderated consumption grows even faster than energy efficiency gains, to the point that it's the only major industry in which the energy intensity of added value is increasing.

(Many sources here: https://theshiftproject.org/en/lean-ict-2/)

We do need a lot of technological investments, but the narrative that says this will be sufficient is a very dangerous mirage. Please, be responsible, do your research, and don't spread ignorance - our children will have to bear the burden.

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