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On Coding, Ego and Attention

josebrowne.com

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Re: On Coding, Ego and Attention

#41

Post by rubicon33 »

I read this, and I have also read "The Practicing Mind" which is exactly what this post is about. My issue isn't in understanding the premise. It all makes sense, and I get a sense of "ah hah!" every time I read it (I've read it twice).

The issue for me is that I really struggle to turn this theory in to effective practice. Each time after reading "The Practicing Mind" I have tried to cognitively remind myself whenever I was frustrated, to stop and look at the problem as a beginner would, to drop my ego, etc.

The problem is that it would sort of help, temporarily. I'd find myself a little bit better at getting a solid day of work done, but not dramatically better. After a week or so, I'd forget to even do the exercises, and I'd be back to struggling.

What honestly helps more than anything, the "magic bullet" really is pharmacology (aderall). For me, it somehow calms me down. I don't feel more energy, I feel tranquil, and able to let defeat roll off my shoulders.

Sadly, taking aderall is not a sustainable solution. Amphetamine is a neurotoxin which raises blood pressure. Not to mention, I don't like being "tranquil" for anything other than my work. I like my 'normal' state of semi-uncontrolled energy, which is great for exercising and video games. I'd like to be able to turn this feeling on or off, and taking a medication doesn't allow for this.

So I tend to see saw between three states... 1) Struggling at work, barely getting by, quality of life sucks. 2) On medication, happy at work, feeling productive and peaceful, but desire to get off medication 3) Off medication, using "Beginners Mind" but find my ability to implement it in a way that is strongly effective, absent.

Re: On Coding, Ego and Attention

#44

Post by cybernabjo »

slindz wrote: post #20
cloogshicer wrote: post #7

Pretty interesting article. If this spoke to you, I recommend reading "The drama of the gifted child" by Alice Miller. Don't be put off by the title, it's a wonderful read no matter if you think you're gifted or not.

Counter point: I read that book this year. It definitely contributed towards resolving some unresolved childhood trauma, and I'm grateful for it, but it was no walk in the park.

Why is that a counter point?

Re: On Coding, Ego and Attention

#45

Post by Vysero »

I can relate to the parallels between programming, and athletics. I like to consider myself an athlete, and if there is one thing I have learned about sports it's that the process of falling from the top to the middle of the pack can happen in a week despite that it can take years to get from the middle of the pack to the top.

So when the author was talking about how being an expert is really just a matter of become a great student I was quickly reminded of my golf game. Where I often time find myself with the lowest handicap I have ever had without actually feeling like I am improving. I shave a stroke one day. Then another.. and another, and before I know it I am a 3 instead of a 10.

That being said, I wouldn't say I have an ego problem in coding myself because tbh I have always felt like a bit of an imposter. I think my imposter syndrome has actually ended up being a good thing over time in my career as a programmer. It seems to have kept me grounded, and as the author suggested is a good thing, it seems to have kept me in the forever a student mentality.

Re: On Coding, Ego and Attention

#46

Post by collyw »

jwilber wrote: post #28
greyvmatter wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Programming isn't necessarily the best way to get better at programming, there are a bunch of related skills that also need to be improved. Thinking about how you program and behave as a human will unlock many doors

Programming is certainly the best way to get better at programming. Some other things may help improve your ability to program, but there is no substitute for the act itself.

Nah, I am agreement with the poster that you replied to.

Our tech lead is a bit of a diva. He is smart but basically he just programs and doesn't bother with much else. He bangs out code quickly, but it can be buggy and its usually the rest of the team that fix the bugs, keep the infrastructure running, write the tests. He is good at tricky algorithmic stuff. His code is fairly well organised. I don't find his abstractions particularly good. The REST API he created is terrible (poor abstraction) and not RESTful a lot of it uses POST requests, 200 success contains errors. No tests. Terrible at explaining his work to other people. Poor at listening.

Give me a good team player with average ability over a good programmer that lacks the other skills any day.

Re: On Coding, Ego and Attention

#47

Post by pak9rabid »

rubicon33 wrote: post #41

I read this, and I have also read "The Practicing Mind" which is exactly what this post is about. My issue isn't in understanding the premise. It all makes sense, and I get a sense of "ah hah!" every time I read it (I've read it twice). The issue for me is that I really struggle to turn this theory in to effective practice. Each time after reading "The Practicing Mind" I have tried to cognitively remind myself whenev…

Funny you mention Adderall, as I just took one today to help be more productive after a long, exhaustive weekend out of town. I totally agree what you say about how it affects work in a positive way, but that it isn't a sustainable solution. I believe the key is moderation. I won't allow myself to use one more than once a week at most, which I feel does a good job of keeping any sort of psychological dependence on it away, minimizes the negative physical repercussions it could cause, and to keep the feeling fresh.

Re: On Coding, Ego and Attention

#48

Post by andrewedstrom »

pistachiopro wrote: post #18

This post did not reach the conclusion I was expecting based on the title. For me, I think I've largely experienced the opposite relationship between ego and my programming productivity. Learning to program as a kid was probably one of the most exciting developments in my life up to that point, and I expect that's true for many people on this forum. I originally attributed this to programming's usefulness, and the ma…

This really resonated with me.

Before getting into programming, I was a somewhat accomplished guitar player. By the time I was 20, I had played in a bunch of bands, recorded several albums, and gone on tour. As a result of these early successes, I developed a big ego about myself as a musician.

I realize now that the main thing driving my musical career was that ego. I enjoyed playing, but getting better at my craft was not my primary driver. Instead, it was that I wanted to be famous and rich and noteworthy and desirable. For me, playing guitar was inexorably linked with becoming a certain kind of person and gaining status.

Now any time I pick the guitar back up for more than a day or two, I quickly get lost in delusions of grandeur. I start thinking about how I'm going to change my whole lifestyle to "be a great guitar player" and playing itself takes the back seat to fantasizing about gaining power and status. Try as I might I can't just casually play guitar for its own sake—kind of like how you have trouble programming without the promise of a conference talk or an influential git repo coming out of it.

For me the solution has been to avoid playing music, and to focus on programming (and my family/friends) instead. I think the groove of ego I carved out as a guitarist is just too deep to allow me a healthier relationship to music. As a programmer, I don't have that same narcissistic false-self to live up to. I just enjoy it and want to get better because it's fun.

Maybe the solution for you could be to take up a creative pursuit other than programming?

Re: On Coding, Ego and Attention

#49

Post by moreaccountspls »

staycoolboy wrote: post #38
moreaccountspls wrote: post #27

"This is ego distraction. It’s about putting off uncertainty till later to buy temporary relief. To protect our ego from a perceived threat. Things like hard problems, the possibility of failing publicly, or negative feedback all become threats when they’re linked to my identity." I disagree with this [at least for me personally]. Being a good programmer is just straight up not something that's part of my identity. T…

> I disagree with this [at least for me personally]. Being a good programmer is just straight up not something that's part of my identity. There's millions of people who are much, much better at it then me, and that's totally fine. Then why did you call yourself "good", why not just a programmer? ;-)

I didn't. I said that being a "good programmer" isn't part of my identity...

Re: On Coding, Ego and Attention

#50

Post by mchan889 »

moksly wrote: post #22
halfcreative wrote: post #14

I feel like for me, reading and writing articles like this are a major source of distractions. I often find myself reading articles like this, lessons of self-improvement and tips of motivation and ways to be a better programmer, instead of doing what actually makes me a better programmer (actually programming). To extend upon the article, I feel like one of the easiest distractions from self improvement is constantl…

The thing about working on yourself is that it’s actually work. Reading an article, or a book on behaviour, self-improvement and what else doesn’t actually change you any more than reading Harry Potter does. It’s the years of applying Zen Buddhism, scheduling your chores or staring at the mirror telling yourself you’re a great person that changes you. I know because I recently recorded from a major depression and anx…

"The thing about working on yourself is that it’s actually work. Reading an article, or a book on behaviour, self-improvement and what else doesn’t actually change you any more than reading Harry Potter does."

This is well put, and I think part of the reason so much self-improvement material is drivel. Generally, I've noticed that some of the most pathological people are the most into 'self-improvement' as an idea. That being said, their brand of 'self-improvement' generally does not extend beyond reading and quoting books by various gurus.

On the flip-side, those I've met who are actually highly motivated and disciplined, have never picked up one of those guru books.

Reading up on something is one thing, and in many cases, it's an important first step. There's no way to start using a new language without reading something. That being said, simply reading is not enough. On top of that, what you read has to be actionable. The self-improvement platitudes are not actionable. Reading a book on Python does not turn you into a python developer. Why should reading a guru book turn you into one?

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