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Everyone thinks they're hiring the top 1% (2005)

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Re: Everyone thinks they're hiring the top 1% (2005)

#41

Post by rapind »

joe_the_user wrote: post #4

One great take-down of this kind of thing. Another point to consider is that there's more to people than just good or bad. Sure, some people just don't have the skills they need. But there are a lot of situations where someone can be great at one job and terrible at another depending on the fit . The posturing about "the 1%", "A-players" and so-forth misses the idea that you want an optimal team , not magic people gu…

I couldn't agree more. It's all about the fit with the team and their interest in the work you're hiring for.

IMO 99% of the time you hear someone say 1%, they're intentionally exaggerating (marketing) or they're clueless on the topic.

I'm a mediocre developer at best, and yet I still have a decent sized ego. I can only imagine how big my head would be if I were top 1%. You definitely wouldn't want to work with me.

Re: Everyone thinks they're hiring the top 1% (2005)

#42

Post by Tycho »

joe_the_user wrote: post #4

One great take-down of this kind of thing. Another point to consider is that there's more to people than just good or bad. Sure, some people just don't have the skills they need. But there are a lot of situations where someone can be great at one job and terrible at another depending on the fit . The posturing about "the 1%", "A-players" and so-forth misses the idea that you want an optimal team , not magic people gu…

The guy who started programming Facebook with Zuckerbeg apparently had just finished 'Perl for Dummies' and never coded before in his life...

(the For Dummies books are really good, mind you)

Re: Everyone thinks they're hiring the top 1% (2005)

#43

Post by Tycho »

potatolicious wrote: post #26
nailer wrote: post #25

Last year I was interviewed by a company that frequently proclaims they hire the top 1% of candidates. The role was working on infrastructure apps using Python, as a Site Reliability Engineer... The interviewer proclaimed he knew Python. Later, during a programming question, after he didn't quite understand the code presented as an answer, I reconfirmed this. His response, quoting: 'I do know Python, but I'm not fami…

If you think you're hiring the top 1%, but you're not paying at top-1% levels, you're probably not actually hiring the top 1%. That's my main takeaway anyhow. Extraordinary people command extraordinary compensation - if you can't cough up the cash you're not going to get to play.

What would you say was the lower bound for the top 1% salary range?

Re: Everyone thinks they're hiring the top 1% (2005)

#44

Post by goombastic »

Hiring is such a huge shot in the dark. I've seen HR guys and hiring managers give elaborate reasons about a profile they want, more often the person they are looking for doesn't exist. More like wanting people with 30 yrs of Java exp. The thing about today's hiring is that companies aren't willing to allow people to learn anything on a job since it's a cost.

Re: Everyone thinks they're hiring the top 1% (2005)

#45

Post by bartonfink »

edw519 wrote: post #40

In fact, one thing I have noticed is that the people who I consider to be good software developers barely ever apply for jobs at all. Good point. The best developers I ever hired were (a) already working, (b) not looking, (c) referred, and (d) without a current resume. Therefore, the people who I consider to be good software developers probably don't have a current resume. Therefore, the top 1% of good software devel…

Just to play devil's advocate, doesn't that rest on the assumption that the top 1% of software developers are also strong enough networkers that they can get a job pretty much anywhere without using the formal channels which would require item (d)? I'm not at all convinced that's the case, even though I understand that there's some truth to the conclusion.

Re: Everyone thinks they're hiring the top 1% (2005)

#47

Post by jasonlotito »

edw519 wrote: post #40

In fact, one thing I have noticed is that the people who I consider to be good software developers barely ever apply for jobs at all. Good point. The best developers I ever hired were (a) already working, (b) not looking, (c) referred, and (d) without a current resume. Therefore, the people who I consider to be good software developers probably don't have a current resume. Therefore, the top 1% of good software devel…

I don't know. Oh, if this was true, I'd feel great. See, I've never applied for a job, but I've been working in software for 10+ years now. I've never submitted a resume. It's always been recommendations and companies coming after me and trying to recruit me. Hell, my current job I got by being recommended to one of the partners by some other guy I never met who apparently worked with something I did!?

Point is, I don't feel like I'm in the top 1%. Oh, I'm good at my job, and I know what I'm doing, and my domain knowledge, I think, is solid, but I know so little. There is so much I don't know, and so much more to learn.

Or maybe I'm just taking the 1% part too literal? Or, maybe, I'm just underestimating the size of the 99%.

Re: Everyone thinks they're hiring the top 1% (2005)

#48

Post by Goronmon »

jasonlotito wrote: post #47
edw519 wrote: post #40

In fact, one thing I have noticed is that the people who I consider to be good software developers barely ever apply for jobs at all. Good point. The best developers I ever hired were (a) already working, (b) not looking, (c) referred, and (d) without a current resume. Therefore, the people who I consider to be good software developers probably don't have a current resume. Therefore, the top 1% of good software devel…

I don't know. Oh, if this was true, I'd feel great. See, I've never applied for a job, but I've been working in software for 10+ years now. I've never submitted a resume. It's always been recommendations and companies coming after me and trying to recruit me. Hell, my current job I got by being recommended to one of the partners by some other guy I never met who apparently worked with something I did!? Point is, I do…

Point is, I don't feel like I'm in the top 1%.

Well, to be fair, you're stretching the logic being applied a bit. There is a big difference between saying "The top 1% of developers don't have resumes" and "Anyone who doesn't have a current resume is one of the top 1% of developers."

Re: Everyone thinks they're hiring the top 1% (2005)

#49

Post by jasonlotito »

cldwalker wrote: post #46

Why are we submitting 5+ year old content?

For a few reasons, probably.

1. It's directly related to the startup world. Startups hire people, and this is advice for that. 2. Not everyone would have read it. Things come up. Being 5-years-old in this context isn't bad. 3. It's far better than some of the other articles here dealing with body image and piracy

Re: Everyone thinks they're hiring the top 1% (2005)

#50

Post by gaius »

Tycho wrote: post #43
potatolicious wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you think you're hiring the top 1%, but you're not paying at top-1% levels, you're probably not actually hiring the top 1%. That's my main takeaway anyhow. Extraordinary people command extraordinary compensation - if you can't cough up the cash you're not going to get to play.

What would you say was the lower bound for the top 1% salary range?

If you are in London then you are competing for talent with the financial services industry which will pay senior devs 100k and up.
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