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Using Bee Stings to Treat Lyme Disease

texasmonthly.com

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Re: Using Bee Stings to Treat Lyme Disease

#41

Post by skazazes »

magic_beans wrote: post #2

This sounds a lot like the Amazonian medicine Kambo, which is tree frog poison. The practitioner burns a small hole on the top layer of the recipient's skin, rubs off the burnt layer, and applies a drop of frog poison mixed with the saliva. The poison almost immediately causes an extreme lymphatic reaction that is thought to clear toxins from the body. Kambo is called the vaccine of the Amazon. The bee sting mechanis…

My older brother received this exact treatment specifically for persistent Lyme. The procedure was repeated ten times over the course of ten days, and he claims all symptoms he had attributed to the infection were gone within a day following the second treatment. Anecdotal, I know, but I am planing on going through with the process myself once I have the time as I can personally see the difference in his energy level, and cognitive performance. I can relay questions if anyone is interested.

Re: Using Bee Stings to Treat Lyme Disease

#42

Post by Slenth »

GordonS wrote: post #34
obelos wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Somewhat diverging from the topic, but I wonder how many “chronic Lyme” cases people self-diagnose are instances of parvovirus B19. I'm in the process of recovering from a B19 infection now, but had my kids not gotten it first and displayed the classic slapped-face rash of parvo, I would have almost certainly gone down the Lyme rabbit hole based on the signs and symptoms I've been experiencing. The spontaneous appear…

I had a look at the Wikipedia page for parvovirus B19, but I don't see many similarities to what chronic Lyme sufferers say; they generally complain of chronic pain that lasts for several months or years, not just weeks. Lyme sufferers also generally claim to have been bitten by a tick, and had them characteristic target rash, rather than a "slapped face" rash. Honestly not sure what would make you think "Lyme" with…

I believe the idea is that once the rheumatoid arthritis pops up suddenly and lasts for weeks, it's easy to jump to a conclusion it could be the beginning of the chronic pain from Lyme disease, and that you just didn't find the tick, etc.

Re: Using Bee Stings to Treat Lyme Disease

#43

Post by stevebmark »

The only two relevant paragraphs in the article:

> In the years that followed, an increasing number of Lyme sufferers started using Lobel’s technique, with good outcomes. Not only did they say they felt better, they said that it saved their lives. Wanting to combine Lobel’s protocol with a more holistic approach, Dolan started a Facebook group of her own called “Healing Lyme With Bee Venom,” where more than 5,500 members post their questions and testimonials. “Year 1 was rough on my husband,” wrote the spouse of one Lyme sufferer who used the bee therapy. “Yesterday he walked seven miles hiking thru a state park.” “I was bedridden when I first started and I more or less lead a normal life now,” said another group member.

> It is possible—some would say probable—that these individuals are promoting a technique whose success is based more on psychology than pharmacology. There is little science to substantiate a cure by stinging. There have been two clinical studies investigating the link between bee venom and Lyme, and though they are compelling, they are confined to petri dishes. A 1997 study and a 2017 study showed the interaction of bee venom’s primary component, melittin, and the Lyme bacteria, Borrelia burgdorferi. Melittin, which is a helical peptide consisting of 26 amino acids, tends to bore a hole in the outer membrane of the larger, spiral-shaped Borrelia burgdorferi, releasing the inner contents of the bacteria just as a corkscrew would slice open a water balloon.

Re: Using Bee Stings to Treat Lyme Disease

#44

Post by mrtnmcc »

I once thought I had chronic Lyme but eventually concluded it was overactive immune system related.

The value of intentional bee stings is still plausible here as there seems to value in giving the immune system 'something else to work on'.

One example is the intentional infection by intestinal tapeworm to alleviate allergies https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2010/may/23/parasit...

I thought it was interesting in the article that she was 'misdiagnosed as autoimmune arthritis'. I think it's reasonable that these autoimmune reactions could be triggered by Lyme or other factors. Curious that all the symptoms associated with Lyme are immune related (rashes, presence of antibody levels in the blood).

The clue that an overactive immune system was causing my issues came from 23andme genetic testing show many genes associated with immune disorders. Also I found that Poison Oak / Ivy would trigger many of the issues including full body reactions for months.

Re: Using Bee Stings to Treat Lyme Disease

#45

Post by dwiel »

refurb wrote: post #26
magic_beans wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been told by a practitioner that saliva activates the kambo better than plain water, but who knows. I've been trying kambo for ulcerative colitis over the past year. My gastroenterologist is perfectly happy to have me take a variety of medications for the rest of my life , whose safety has only been studied over a six-month period. Western medicine gets the job done, it's true, but it's time to open our minds to…

Western medicine is just defined as medicine that has been through a rigorous clinical trial process that actually proves it works. Until these Eastern medicine have gone through the same process, it’s just anecdotal evidence.

That definition practically speaking though also has other implications. Primarily that the only medicine that even gets the opportunity to go through a clinical trial process. Some medicines are so abundant that it's hard to profit from discoveries about them.

Re: Using Bee Stings to Treat Lyme Disease

#46

Post by fortran77 »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #16
mgamache wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“chronic Lyme” is probably something, just probably not literally 'chronic Lyme'. The problem is, if you think you know the cause you'll stop looking for the actual cause.

Sometimes what a person calls “chronic Lyme” isn’t actually anything, at least not anything pathological. I have very noticeable eye floaters (which any doctor will tell you are completely benign debris in the eye’s vitreous) and I have occasionally done a web search to learn more about how they arise, what they really look like, etc. But web searches for eye floaters these days tend to bring up a lot of people claim…

You'll also see people touting gluten-free diets to help the symptoms of "Chronic Lyme Disease" and the theory that "Chronic Lyme Disease" causes "Non-Celiac Gluten Sensitivity" (google it for mind-numbing websites).

Re: Using Bee Stings to Treat Lyme Disease

#47

Post by pkaye »

cpncrunch wrote: post #39
chefandy wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are technically right, but I find this pedantry counterproductive. When someone is simply frustrated by their lack of options to alleviate their suffering, inserting yourself solely to make sure they're using the rightest possible terminology while ignoring their actual point a) doesn't add anything of value to the discussion, unless the distinctions between any of these terms can materially advance the discussio…

The problem is that most of these people who are diagnosed by "chronic lyme" actually have CFS (according to multiple studies). So, it's unlikely that any lyme treatments will work for these patients. As for CFS, many people do fully recover from that (I have myself, for example). But going down the chronic lyme rabbit hole is unlikely to bring any kind of relief.

What exactly is CFS?

Re: Using Bee Stings to Treat Lyme Disease

#49

Post by cpncrunch »

pkaye wrote: post #47
cpncrunch wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that most of these people who are diagnosed by "chronic lyme" actually have CFS (according to multiple studies). So, it's unlikely that any lyme treatments will work for these patients. As for CFS, many people do fully recover from that (I have myself, for example). But going down the chronic lyme rabbit hole is unlikely to bring any kind of relief.

What exactly is CFS?

Chronic fatigue syndrome.

Re: Using Bee Stings to Treat Lyme Disease

#50

Post by refurb »

dwiel wrote: post #45
refurb wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Western medicine is just defined as medicine that has been through a rigorous clinical trial process that actually proves it works. Until these Eastern medicine have gone through the same process, it’s just anecdotal evidence.

That definition practically speaking though also has other implications. Primarily that the only medicine that even gets the opportunity to go through a clinical trial process. Some medicines are so abundant that it's hard to profit from discoveries about them.

It’s true there isn’t a financial motivation, but there are plenty of trials run with government grants.

Fact is, if they really are beneficial, physicians want to know and are willing to spend time and money to collect data.

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