Electric scooters aren't as eco-friendly as they seem, study finds • Hacker News Board

Re: Electric scooters aren't as eco-friendly as they seem, study finds

#41

Post by gamblor956 » Sun, Aug 04, 2019, 12:57 AM UTC

jkoudys wrote: post #32

sebringj wrote: post #29

Cars/bikes etc don't have carbon footprints to manufacture? This is an idiotic comparison.

It's asinine. I might as well include the CO2 footprint of the wear on your shoes and pants from walking.

You could, if you wanted an ultra-detailed comparison.

And scooters would still be found wanting. Pants and shoes can survive a few months of daily wear. With proper care, even cheapo stuff from Target/Walmart can last for years.

Right now, Bird and its competitors are struggling to get six months of lifespan out of scooters used an average of just 3 times a day.

Re: Electric scooters aren't as eco-friendly as they seem, study finds

#42

Post by kevin_thibedeau » Sun, Aug 04, 2019, 1:06 AM UTC

Retric wrote: post #36

megaremote wrote: post #25

Still 1000x better than cars, and anything that gets people out of their cars is great.

Expect you many need to literally manufacture 1,500x as many scooters. ‘The average vehicle went 163.2 miles over 92 trips during its lifetime’ https://qz.com/1561654/how-long-does-a-scooter-last-less-tha... So, odd as it may seem, electric cars may be better for the environment.

The average bicycle isn't any better. Huffy knew this and purposely designed their bikes for a lifetime of 50 miles. We should get rid of them too.

Re: Electric scooters aren't as eco-friendly as they seem, study finds

#43

Post by navigatesol » Sun, Aug 04, 2019, 11:50 AM UTC

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #42

Retric wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Expect you many need to literally manufacture 1,500x as many scooters. ‘The average vehicle went 163.2 miles over 92 trips during its lifetime’ https://qz.com/1561654/how-long-does-a-scooter-last-less-tha... So, odd as it may seem, electric cars may be better for the environment.

The average bicycle isn't any better. Huffy knew this and purposely designed their bikes for a lifetime of 50 miles. We should get rid of them too.

How exactly does one go about this? Is it built from paper? Has Silicon Valley actually convinced themselves that bicycles are bad for the environment now?

Re: Electric scooters aren't as eco-friendly as they seem, study finds

#44

Post by thatfrenchguy » Sun, Aug 04, 2019, 4:33 PM UTC

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #42

Retric wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Expect you many need to literally manufacture 1,500x as many scooters. ‘The average vehicle went 163.2 miles over 92 trips during its lifetime’ https://qz.com/1561654/how-long-does-a-scooter-last-less-tha... So, odd as it may seem, electric cars may be better for the environment.

The average bicycle isn't any better. Huffy knew this and purposely designed their bikes for a lifetime of 50 miles. We should get rid of them too.

I’ve never seen any bikes that has a lifetime of 50 miles. But I’m all for anti-planned obsolescence laws. Maybe just forcing manufacturers to put the expected life of the device next to it would help ?

Re: Electric scooters aren't as eco-friendly as they seem, study finds

#45

Post by kristo » Sun, Aug 04, 2019, 5:55 PM UTC

Retric wrote: post #36

megaremote wrote: post #25

Still 1000x better than cars, and anything that gets people out of their cars is great.

Expect you many need to literally manufacture 1,500x as many scooters. ‘The average vehicle went 163.2 miles over 92 trips during its lifetime’ https://qz.com/1561654/how-long-does-a-scooter-last-less-tha... So, odd as it may seem, electric cars may be better for the environment.

This idea fails to account for MANY car externalities, like the effects of paving the roads and parking lots they need, and the massive environmental opportunity cost associated with those spaces. Scooters are net positive if they get any number of people out of cars. Yes they're worse than bikes, but nobody was really saying they were better.

Re: Electric scooters aren't as eco-friendly as they seem, study finds

#46

Post by algaeontoast » Mon, Aug 05, 2019, 4:19 PM UTC

alistairSH wrote: post #22

nickserv wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're also useful for 'last km' transport, like getting to and from the train station. The smaller ones can also be taken on the bus or subway.

Do you know of any smaller/lighter e-scooters that are easily hand carried and durable? The typical Bird/Lime look a bit heavy for carrying into an office or up to an apartment. I've searched online, but most look like sketchy Chinese stuff, so I'm a bit concerned about longevity and parts availability.

Personally, I just purchased a lump-sum of Ninebot-es2 and es4 models from a Police auction (they were confiscated bird scooters). I just replaced the dashboard and went about using them for personal commuting. The range sucked, I'd be lucky to get 3.5 - 4 miles at 16mph to my office, which meant I had to charge on both ends. This is what lead to my purchase of an KS18xl electric unicycle.

However, there are more and more slim carbon fiber "micro" electric scooters entering the market that look absolutely incredible!

Re: Electric scooters aren't as eco-friendly as they seem, study finds

#47

Post by sebringj » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 3:30 PM UTC

gamblor956 wrote: post #39

sebringj wrote: post #29

Cars/bikes etc don't have carbon footprints to manufacture? This is an idiotic comparison.

Unless you're buying some really crappy cars or bikes, they generally last for several years or decades, compared to the estimated month-6 months lifespan of e-scooters. (Bird has newer scooters coming out that are supposed to last almost a year. Almost a year. For an average of 3 rides a day.) When you're arguing that your mode of transport is green but it only lasts a few weeks with relatively sparse usage, then th…

You have a very good and valid point that I completely missed as I was fooled by the category it resides in.