To me, this feels like an area Uncle Sam and the EU need to get involved in. Declare all censorship or need to comply with the Great Firewall to be a trade barrier, freeze out all Chinese tech companies on that basis, and find a way to strongly discourage American and European companies from in any way enabling it.
Google's Project Dragonfly 'Terminated' in China
41–50 of 305 posts
Re: Google's Project Dragonfly 'Terminated' in China
#42I wonder if they will they put this on killedbygoogle.com?
Is Hollywood on that list? Google, Apple, Amazon, and Netflix are getting blamed for it, but that was more of a YC initiative [0,1] powered by inevitable Internet economics.
[0] RFS 9: Kill Hollywood https://twitter.com/paulg/status/160491053080776706
[1] 2012 Discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3491542
https://web.archive.org/web/20120127114157/http://ycombinato...
Re: Google's Project Dragonfly 'Terminated' in China
#43Does anyone know the exact requirements set by China on google for them to enter the Chinese market? I suppose adherence to Chinese law but what exactly? Support of law enforcement, censorship of specific sites, personal data stored in China etc...
Clear unambiguous rule of law? Dream on, this is China we're talking about!
Re: Google's Project Dragonfly 'Terminated' in China
#44To me, this feels like an area Uncle Sam and the EU need to get involved in. Declare all censorship or need to comply with the Great Firewall to be a trade barrier, freeze out all Chinese tech companies on that basis, and find a way to strongly discourage American and European companies from in any way enabling it.
From the arguments at the time when dragonfly was leaked, it was brought up that there is censorship, though in a different form, already in the EU. Be it right to be forgotten, or filtering of information related to things unsavory to the past of any given country in the EU.
Then the US and EU both have censorship around things protected by law. So you can sue people to take down slanderous material, or material that violates copyrights or trademarks.
Re: Google's Project Dragonfly 'Terminated' in China
#45It's surprising I haven't seen any 50-Cent armiers in here decrying Google for this as of yet.
Re: Google's Project Dragonfly 'Terminated' in China
#46Does anyone know the exact requirements set by China on google for them to enter the Chinese market? I suppose adherence to Chinese law but what exactly? Support of law enforcement, censorship of specific sites, personal data stored in China etc...
Does anyone know whether there are in fact "exact requirements" at all, or whether you just have informal off the record chats with officials where you're given to understand that it would be "looked upon favourably" if this or happens or does not happen. From everything I've read about how China operates it's sort of the exact opposite in one sense from the west. In the west there are rules and there are loopholes a…
>From everything I've read about how China operates it's sort of the exact opposite in one sense from the west.
The main differences can be summarized as "rule of law" versus "rule of people". Also connections with someone in the upper levels of gov't are paramount for any company looking to make it big.
Source: Chinese family members.
Re: Google's Project Dragonfly 'Terminated' in China
#47To me, this feels like an area Uncle Sam and the EU need to get involved in. Declare all censorship or need to comply with the Great Firewall to be a trade barrier, freeze out all Chinese tech companies on that basis, and find a way to strongly discourage American and European companies from in any way enabling it.
Any sort of heavy hand the West takes to “prove” that whatever it is that China is doing (censorship, communism, etc) is wrong/doesn’t work is going to backfire to the highest degree. It will entrench them in their already strong beliefs that the West is only interested in holding progress back from China (out of jealousy at their high economic growth).
If you believe your system is better, then you really should not have to actively participate in fighting opposing systems of belief. Forcing it through just shows that you are motivated by self interest, and not a core belief in the superiority of your own values. Such a strategy will lose the hearts and minds of the people of China as well, and at which point who are you protecting the rights and interests of anymore if those who you seek to “help” aren’t even on your side?
Re: Google's Project Dragonfly 'Terminated' in China
#48To me, this feels like an area Uncle Sam and the EU need to get involved in. Declare all censorship or need to comply with the Great Firewall to be a trade barrier, freeze out all Chinese tech companies on that basis, and find a way to strongly discourage American and European companies from in any way enabling it.
Any sort of heavy hand the West takes to “prove” that whatever it is that China is doing (censorship, communism, etc) is wrong/doesn’t work is going to backfire to the highest degree. It will entrench them in their already strong beliefs that the West is only interested in holding progress back from China (out of jealousy at their high economic growth). If you believe your system is better, then you really should not…
> If you believe your system is better, then you really should not have to actively participate in fighting opposing systems of belief.
Uh why ? I think it's exactly the opposite
Re: Google's Project Dragonfly 'Terminated' in China
#49To me, this feels like an area Uncle Sam and the EU need to get involved in. Declare all censorship or need to comply with the Great Firewall to be a trade barrier, freeze out all Chinese tech companies on that basis, and find a way to strongly discourage American and European companies from in any way enabling it.
Any sort of heavy hand the West takes to “prove” that whatever it is that China is doing (censorship, communism, etc) is wrong/doesn’t work is going to backfire to the highest degree. It will entrench them in their already strong beliefs that the West is only interested in holding progress back from China (out of jealousy at their high economic growth). If you believe your system is better, then you really should not…
> If you believe your system is better, then you really should not have to actively participate in fighting opposing systems of belief. Forcing it through just shows that you are motivated by self interest, and not a core belief in the superiority of your own values.
Uh why ? I think it's exactly the opposite
Re: Google's Project Dragonfly 'Terminated' in China
#50To me, this feels like an area Uncle Sam and the EU need to get involved in. Declare all censorship or need to comply with the Great Firewall to be a trade barrier, freeze out all Chinese tech companies on that basis, and find a way to strongly discourage American and European companies from in any way enabling it.
From the arguments at the time when dragonfly was leaked, it was brought up that there is censorship, though in a different form, already in the EU. Be it right to be forgotten, or filtering of information related to things unsavory to the past of any given country in the EU. Then the US and EU both have censorship around things protected by law. So you can sue people to take down slanderous material, or material tha…
> Be it right to be forgotten
Works for me, and seems to empower the people, rather than the state...
> filtering of information related to things unsavory to the past of any given country in the EU
Could you link me to some credible sources for this?