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When zebra mussels colonized Lake Erie, it began to recover

ecosophia.net

41–50 of 67 posts

Re: When zebra mussels colonized Lake Erie, it began to recover

#41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But for the planetary biosphere, it's a win because the mammals are better suited to living there It's not a win in either case. It's just what happened. Evolution and nature and the biosphere don't have goals.

You raise a good point too. if there are no wins or losses in nature maybe it comes down to promoting species we enjoy most?

How about maximizing diversity? Because it is more fun for people and because it increases fitness of the biosphere as an ultimate ecosystem?

As for me it sounds better. Yes, local people could be annoyed by lions or venomous snakes, but for the most humans lions and snakes are just a curiosity that makes world more interesting.

Re: When zebra mussels colonized Lake Erie, it began to recover

#42
In the text of the article there are words: "we could always roll snake-eyes in the evolutionary crapshoot" I'm not an English native and I cannot grasp the precise meaning of the "to roll snake-eyes". What does it mean? Does the rolling of snake eyes somehow different from rolling human eyes? Or maybe snakes cannot roll their eyes(?) and... I don't know.

Would someone be so nice to explain this, please?

Re: When zebra mussels colonized Lake Erie, it began to recover

#43
post #42

In the text of the article there are words: "we could always roll snake-eyes in the evolutionary crapshoot" I'm not an English native and I cannot grasp the precise meaning of the "to roll snake-eyes". What does it mean? Does the rolling of snake eyes somehow different from rolling human eyes? Or maybe snakes cannot roll their eyes(?) and... I don't know. Would someone be so nice to explain this, please?

"Rolling snake eyes" means rolling two ones on six-sided dice. In many games that's a bad throw, as it only adds to two out of a possible twelve.

Re: When zebra mussels colonized Lake Erie, it began to recover

#44
post #42

In the text of the article there are words: "we could always roll snake-eyes in the evolutionary crapshoot" I'm not an English native and I cannot grasp the precise meaning of the "to roll snake-eyes". What does it mean? Does the rolling of snake eyes somehow different from rolling human eyes? Or maybe snakes cannot roll their eyes(?) and... I don't know. Would someone be so nice to explain this, please?

"snake eyes" is the value '1', '1' with two six sided dice. In the gambling of games of Craps it means the player instantly loses their bet.

Re: When zebra mussels colonized Lake Erie, it began to recover

#45
post #42

In the text of the article there are words: "we could always roll snake-eyes in the evolutionary crapshoot" I'm not an English native and I cannot grasp the precise meaning of the "to roll snake-eyes". What does it mean? Does the rolling of snake eyes somehow different from rolling human eyes? Or maybe snakes cannot roll their eyes(?) and... I don't know. Would someone be so nice to explain this, please?

It refers to getting two 1's when rolling dice. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snake_eyes

Re: When zebra mussels colonized Lake Erie, it began to recover

#46

I wonder if you could invent a pool filter powered by zebra mussels? You’d obviously need a good way to keep them contained in the filter area and out of the piping and pool proper. Can it be done?

I doubt it. Maybe in a natural pool closer to a swimming hole, but who would want those mussels to be in their bool. If they colonize the pool floor, you're going to end up with your feet being cut up.

Re: When zebra mussels colonized Lake Erie, it began to recover

#47
post #29

I think this piece is misguided. Some background: as a kid, my family boated on the SF Bay. I can remember when cormorants were rare on the bay. There were no porpoises or dolphins in the bay. It was rare for a whale to enter the bay. There were zero brown pelicans. All of those observations are entirely opposite of today's bay. Acts of government have seriously improved water ecosystems. Now that memory is a data po…

I believe that the SF Bay losing many larger ocean mammals was related to World War 2 anti-submarine nets that closed off the bay from their migration for years. At least, that's what I recall from a marine mammal course a few years back.

Re: When zebra mussels colonized Lake Erie, it began to recover

#48
post #25

Well, that is one unusual source for an HN submission! Quite interesting read - about the author, from that website: > John Michael Greer is a widely read author and blogger whose work focuses on the overlaps between ecology, spirituality, and the future of industrial society. > He served twelve years as Grand Archdruid of the Ancient Order of Druids in America, and currently heads the Druidical Order of the Golden D…

As you can see from his skeptical remarks about Gaia consciousness in this post, he's pretty sane, despite sounding weird. I've enjoyed reading his blog The Archdruid Report, which I'm disappointed to see he deleted.

Re: When zebra mussels colonized Lake Erie, it began to recover

#49
I've been visiting the St. Lawrence river downstream of the Great Lakes since the 1970s. My mother grew up in the era before the Saint Lawrence Seaway was established in the 50s, which made the river navigable by larger ships (although not container ships) below the Thousand Islands to Montreal and the Gulf of St. Lawrence, opening up the Great Lakes to international shipping and trade.

The river used to be filthy. Lots of industry on the U.S. and Canadian sides and in the Great Lakes dumped all kinds of untreated waste into the ecosystem. I also remember a major oil slick which I believe was caused by a maritime accident. This was before the advent of better navigation technology and environmental protection laws.

The water may have become cleaner over time, but I noticed that by the early 2000s, the types of fish that I had caught off the dock by the dozens as a child in the 70s and 80s -- perch, sunfish, bass -- were becoming extremely rare. Ten years later, these shore species had all but disappeared except for a few bays and harbors.

The disappearance of these fish coincided with the appearance of the zebra mussel. The lore told here is that the zebra mussels were carried over by Ukrainian freighters in the 1990s (similar to the story in TFA). But other new species have appeared on the river, too -- cormorants, carp, and Canadian geese are very visible now, and they weren't in the past.

We also seem to have more extreme variations in water levels, with flooding this year and in 2017, and very low levels in other years. Surely that impacts water temperature and breeding conditions for some aquatic species.

I think some people blamed the zebra mussels and the cormorants for the disappearance of many species of fish, but I think there's a larger story taking place, with many factors contributing to changes in the ecosystem.

Re: When zebra mussels colonized Lake Erie, it began to recover

#50
post #29

I think this piece is misguided. Some background: as a kid, my family boated on the SF Bay. I can remember when cormorants were rare on the bay. There were no porpoises or dolphins in the bay. It was rare for a whale to enter the bay. There were zero brown pelicans. All of those observations are entirely opposite of today's bay. Acts of government have seriously improved water ecosystems. Now that memory is a data po…

The shutdown of industry and decline of agriculture stopped additional pollution, but Zebra mussels are great at utilizing phosphorus, which when present at high levels reduces oxygen in the water.

Shellfish like oysters are present in the San Francisco bay too. They are a key part of the lifecycle, and the colonization of Lake Eire by the mussels helped other life appear.

It’s also hilarious to declare the mussels invasive. The lake was a pitiful, dead environment. Any life is invasive.

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