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Coldfusion is “Unpopular” – I don’t care

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Re: Coldfusion is “Unpopular” – I don’t care

#42
If using Coldfusion, I’d recommend scanning your sites with a service or product like Tenable Security. There are quite a few high priority exploits that we’ve seen over the recent years. These end up being available as one-click takedown type scripts in tools like Metasploit.

Re: Coldfusion is “Unpopular” – I don’t care

#43
I used CF in my first job more than a decade ago. It's not a terrible language. I'm a bit sketchy on the details (having been more than a decade ago) but I recall creating a custom tag that "magically" created an editor for DB row (which in-turn used a custom tag for editing any column). It didn't run in the browser, but, apart from that, it felt a lot like using React/Angular/Vue/Svelte/what-have-you. I quickly built up a library of custom tags, which worked really well in, what was essentially, a shop that was mass-producing websites.

The awesome thing is that I bashed it out in one week, starting from knowing no CFML at all. It was essentially me and my employer building websites (a 3rd or 4th dealt with IT), and he was successful with my work within one day.

It's dumb, it's boring, it's uninteresting, and those are seemingly features. I love Vue and Svelte with a passion, but it takes more than a day to become successful with those (and far longer to become wildly productive).

All of that being said, I don't care to go back to it.

Re: Coldfusion is “Unpopular” – I don’t care

#44

> "Whilst y'all dimwits call us unpopular, we're busy running the world - from health and banking to government and Telco companies. Adobe's Evangelism Kit points out that Coldfusion is utilized by over 70% of the Fortune 100." this is unprofessional and doesn't help drive your point. You're arguing that "dimwits" perceive popularity as a good measurement of the value of a language, and then you point to the language…

While the use of the term "dimwits" is definitely unprofessional, there is considerable value in knowing a language that's used by a small but critical segment.

Case in point, the banking world's use of COBOL. Very few organizations use COBOL anymore, but those who do are using it in some absolutely critical pieces of infrastructure that can't easily be replaced. The combination of low popularity and critical usage means that people who know COBOL are in high demand and can command fantastic salaries due to rarity.

Re: Coldfusion is “Unpopular” – I don’t care

#45
I don't get how you could think "interpreted XML" was a good idea. Great, you don't need context switching the way PHP does it, but instead of properly splitting templates and code, ColdFusion still mixes both while managing to be less readable.

Added to that I feel unable to imagine a piece of indented 80 column wide XML that doesn't somehow curl up on the right edge. It's certainly not for me, but I won't tell you not to use anything.

Paraphrasing a thing I heard on the internet: XML is like violence, if it doesn't solve your problem, maybe you need to use ColdFusion?

Re: Coldfusion is “Unpopular” – I don’t care

#46
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OTOH, all reasons are cons... an expert in an esoteric system with none of those will be paid her weight in gold by the fewer employers in need of a very finite resource... while js programmers are a dime a dozen.

If one language is expensive, and another language is cheap which do you think employers will be building NEW software in? I've seen people who follow the strategy you prescribe, and while they did make above market while they helped companies migrate away from [dying technology] they eventually became unemployable. It simply isn't a good long term play, for either employee or employer.

It's a good endgame for an engineer. If you've got experience with X language and you're planning your exit from the industry.

Better yet, be the guy who can upgrade a system like that from X language to the newer one that can be maintained by the your new wave of engineers.

Re: Coldfusion is “Unpopular” – I don’t care

#47
Author, glad you don't care. You've failed to convince me that I need to learn cold fusion now or in the future.

Let me tell a story. I know of a billing system that was written in IBM RPG. Up until 2008ish, it was still being maintained and distributed. The guy that wrote it was the sole owner and maintainer of this billing company and swore up and down that RPG was the best language in the world and he'd never consider writing in anything else.

But guess what happened? He couldn't hire anyone else to maintain this system. Further, it was slowly and obviously decaying. Operating the system was a full time job for 2 employees. Eventually the companies using that software abandoned it for a solution that was maintained by a company that was both larger and had a workforce of more than 1. Those companies cut their billing staff to it being a part time job for just 1 person.

Why do I tell this story? Because you can literally replace "ColdFusion" with "RPG" and you'll have the same article that guy would have written. That guy's business is shutdown now.

Popularity IS important. Popularity feeds support and stability. The author is free to cling onto a language that, frankly, I thought WAS dead. But he'd be well advised to brush up on one of the more "Popular" languages and techs.

Re: Coldfusion is “Unpopular” – I don’t care

#48
"This doesn't hold up for the simple reason that dying languages aren't kept up to date! Check out the list of COBOL releases on Wikipedia - frankly, only two major versions released since 80's spells obvious doom for the COBOL ecosystem.

Contrast this with Adobe Coldfusion, with four major releases since 2012"

Is that tongue in cheek?

Re: Coldfusion is “Unpopular” – I don’t care

#49
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OTOH, all reasons are cons... an expert in an esoteric system with none of those will be paid her weight in gold by the fewer employers in need of a very finite resource... while js programmers are a dime a dozen.

If one language is expensive, and another language is cheap which do you think employers will be building NEW software in? I've seen people who follow the strategy you prescribe, and while they did make above market while they helped companies migrate away from [dying technology] they eventually became unemployable. It simply isn't a good long term play, for either employee or employer.

In the long run we are all dead. -- John Maynard Keynes

For some, the short term payoff is the right strategy. Also how is it not good for the employer? Assuming they could fire the person (or just hire him/her as contract).

Re: Coldfusion is “Unpopular” – I don’t care

#50
post #8

A year or two ago I would have replied that ColdFusion is actually dead, and that using it or really, even, maintaining applications in it is irresponsible, because it's virtually impossible to secure. But I think it may have become so archaic that vulnerability researchers aren't really hitting it as much any more? Maybe you've weathered the storm, and CF will be safe to use from here on out? (Obviously: don't use C…

>Maybe you've weathered the storm

Not if the decade-old bugs keep coming back

https://www.exploit-db.com/exploits/16788

https://www.exploit-db.com/exploits/45979

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