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Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

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Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#41
post #32

USA is heading down this road, too. 21 states will suspend your driver's license if you fall behind on student debt. This is ass backwards and destructive thinking. I am certain this is just the start of greater restrictions on the unfortunate.

Are you serious? That sounds like a stupid idea, what if you need a car for/to reach work? then this is really counterproductive.

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you talking about the B.E.N.S.[0] program? Then yes, companies can currently target individuals very easily/illegally using the fusion centers. It's widely known that american companies have this capability but don't really know the details... [0]: https://www.bens.org/

No, I wasn't talking about anything specific. Just the general setup of having a large part of US surveillance performed by commercial entities, combined with the ability of public companies administering critical services to refuse doing business with arbitrary individuals. For example: see the "unbanked". Rather than fixing the banking system so that basic transactions do not rely on credit, it's easier to create a…

I guess people can be blacklisted. Google, Microsoft, and a bunch of others have blacklists from which they harass people and the banks I guess can refuse to process individual's transactions in their version of an orwellian wet dream but they threaten the company's integrity when they do that many times over.

"O there just been a mistake at the bank" goes to "they are racially profiling me" very quickly. These very same programs target political activists.

Also it doesn't help that there are decentralized alternative popping up everywhere. If monero(crypto coin) ever became mainstream, the world would be a very different place.

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#43
post #2

This system seems inhumane. I’ll consider supporting a boycott of China if it would help.

I don't understand the fear of the social credit system. It doesn't seem too different from the American credit scoring system. They are both systems designed by the elites to shape the behavior of commoners. Why do I have to regularly use a credit card to prove that I am credit worthy, so that I can get a bank loan to buy a house?

Because the bank wants assurance that you’re not going to go bankrupt or just not pay it back, and reliably paying off your credit card is a proxy for that.

Whereas you taking a high speed train is not a risk, so blocking that is just punishment.

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#44
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know. I sometimes manufacture physical products. I could state publically that I won’t. I could also not buy products made in China personally. In general we ought to try to change things we don’t like. I can’t imagine the people of China like this system do they?

They do, actually! Source: https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/03/21/what-do-p... Presumably a system that promotes good behavior is well liked by people who haven't run afoul of it. And of course, via censorship practices, a very small percentage of Chinese citizens are aware of a lot of reasons they should be concerned about their government. Russian citizens are also wildly enthusiastic about Vladimir Put…

> They do, actually! Source: https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/03/21/what-do-p...

> Presumably a system that promotes good behavior is well liked by people who haven't run afoul of it. And of course, via censorship practices, a very small percentage of Chinese citizens are aware of a lot of reasons they should be concerned about their government.

For that reason, I think it's important to take such public-opinion data with a grain of salt. You have to wait until people have enough direct contact with the system in question so they can form an informed opinion of it.

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#45
post #32

USA is heading down this road, too. 21 states will suspend your driver's license if you fall behind on student debt. This is ass backwards and destructive thinking. I am certain this is just the start of greater restrictions on the unfortunate.

As I've been reminded countless times, "driving is a privilege not a right". You can lose your license for all kinds of 'unfair' reasons that do not make sense, and I agree it's heavy handed to include student loan debt, but until it is Federally acknowledged that all citizens have a right to drive (after passing proper license tests), then this downward progression will continue.

In California you can't even register your vehicle if you're behind on your child support payments. (I need my job to make payments. I can't get to my job without my car.)

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#47
post #32

USA is heading down this road, too. 21 states will suspend your driver's license if you fall behind on student debt. This is ass backwards and destructive thinking. I am certain this is just the start of greater restrictions on the unfortunate.

As I've been reminded countless times, "driving is a privilege not a right". You can lose your license for all kinds of 'unfair' reasons that do not make sense, and I agree it's heavy handed to include student loan debt, but until it is Federally acknowledged that all citizens have a right to drive (after passing proper license tests), then this downward progression will continue. In California you can't even registe…

Sure, but none of that changes the fact that suspending someone's driving privilege as a punishment for failing to pay a debt is incredibly stupid and counterproductive.

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#48
Anytime a criticism of China's social credit score is brought up, there's always a "yeah but US credit score", yet I still don't understand how the two are even in the same ballpark.

The social credit score in China is far more invasive and penalizes you for associating yourself with individuals who have low scores.

To compare the two is disingenuous and reaks of whataboutism

Re: Life on the wrong side of China’s social credit system

#49
post #2

This system seems inhumane. I’ll consider supporting a boycott of China if it would help.

I don't understand the fear of the social credit system. It doesn't seem too different from the American credit scoring system. They are both systems designed by the elites to shape the behavior of commoners. Why do I have to regularly use a credit card to prove that I am credit worthy, so that I can get a bank loan to buy a house?

I think the fear come from how hard it would be to dig out of the hole. People make mistakes. Under the American system the mistakes expire after time.

I have not heard of the expiration of offences in this system. This social credit system is new an may evolve with time.

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