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Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

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Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#41

Post by jonnydubowsky »

anon007 wrote: post #14

I personally was approached by what I now believe was an undercover spy agent in San Francisco. I believe he might have been Israeli. How we got there is a long story. But, the person (agent) came to a coffee shop that I frequented and made himself very visible talking audibly about certain areas that were my interest. I'm a very outgoing person so after over-hearing him by the second or third encounter there, I appr…

The spy vs spy comic strip gave us some early lessons on how deep these deceptions can go. Double and triple agents, even people creating anonymous accounts online to put forth whatever unfounded and creative stories they wish about anyone they choose.

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#42

Post by Simon321 »

walrus01 wrote: post #16

More on the firm named in the article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Cube https://www.timesofisrael.com/cambridge-analytica-linked-bus... https://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-5397148,00.html Why am I not surprised that it's linked to Cambridge Analytica?

Not just that but they also seem linked to the Bezos incident! https://www.philly.com/opinion/commentary/jeff-bezos-nationa...

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#44

Post by meowface »

agumonkey wrote: post #40
Haga wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Massive discredit for any cause you push?

it's just a bit outside what I/we consider spies roles. This sounds more like the usual PR trick.

It's because it isn't the Israeli government/Israeli intelligence who's doing this (even if many or most of the operatives are ex-intelligence): it's people in private industry. It's plausible some aspects of the Israeli government also have a hand in this stuff, but I think it's explainable without that as well.

NSO Group, the firm mentioned in this and other articles, and firms like Black Cube (hired by Harvey Weinstein to spy on accusers) seem to be effectively running an intelligence-agency-as-a-service model. They'll deploy agents and compromise devices to discredit any potential witness, gather reconnaissance on potential stories that are being written, spread disinformation, influence policy, etc. All you have to do is give them money.

As for the motive: no idea. But this seems to be a popular tactic for discrediting people, especially recently after some people accused NSO Group of helping spy on Jamal Khashoggi (edit: and there's also at least one lawsuit). Tarring their accusers as anti-Semites is one way of dealing with bad PR. I don't know what the parent poster may have done or what their situation might be, but they or their employer may be in competition, or a feud, with some resourceful Israeli companies or individuals.

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#45

Post by agumonkey »

meowface wrote: post #44
agumonkey wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's just a bit outside what I/we consider spies roles. This sounds more like the usual PR trick.

It's because it isn't the Israeli government/Israeli intelligence who's doing this (even if many or most of the operatives are ex-intelligence): it's people in private industry. It's plausible some aspects of the Israeli government also have a hand in this stuff, but I think it's explainable without that as well. NSO Group, the firm mentioned in this and other articles, and firms like Black Cube (hired by Harvey Wein…

that's what I was trying to say, boldly discrediting people seems outside the spying field. I defined it as 'stealth information acquisition'. Not political con artistry.

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#46

Post by PavlovsCat »

bayesian_horse wrote: post #34
heyjudy wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends. It could've been grooming for recruitment or unwitting exploitation: either he was trying to prove he wasn't Israeli by dabbling in anti-semitism and/or collect Kompropat that could ratchet up leverage from one minor ask to gradually larger ones. Several agencies of the US govt are known to deploy facial recognition monitoring of social media for known foreign agents and place calls to employers if their…

I sense some anti-isreali sentiment among somewhat valid criticism right there. The issue is complicated by Israel being a US-ally so technically it's not that much of an issue of Israeli "agents" talking to Americans.

What of the criticism is not valid, so it can only be explained by "anti-Israeli sentiment"? Is someone who is critical of some of the doings of the NSA or CIA "anti-American"? The issue is complicated by antisemitism being very real, just like there's people who hate America as such. But there is no need to jump to that, especially when you haven't even said what in your estimation makes the criticism only "somewhat" valid.

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#47

Post by baybal2 »

inglor wrote: post #37
avip wrote: post #36

To clarify: NSO is a private company, mostly owned by US firm. The involvement of "Israel" in whatever NSO is doing is as follows: 1. As a vendor of security sensitive products, any NSO deal would be approved by Israel's MOD. 2. They naturally employ loads of secret service "graduates" because it's good for business. Consequently, calling an apparently clumsy NSO employee "an Israeli spy" comes across as kind of fake…

I’m not sure why this is downvoted - this is absolutely true. NSO is a private company who is US owned and at odds with the Israeli government often. As an Israeli I’m pretty confident Israel would not send spies in order to do things related to NSO’s private business. If anything - these are US spies and not Israeli ones. It just doesn’t make sense for Israel to do this. Not that Israel doesn’t do shabby spywork or…

> NSO is a private company who is US owned and at odds with the Israeli government often.

But is stuffed full of ex-officers from Israel's military. Don't you find it odd? Why they seem to keep coming, while at the same time switching back and forth in between army and "civilian" career?

That's a rather dumb cover.

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#48

Post by avip »

meowface wrote: post #44
agumonkey wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's just a bit outside what I/we consider spies roles. This sounds more like the usual PR trick.

It's because it isn't the Israeli government/Israeli intelligence who's doing this (even if many or most of the operatives are ex-intelligence): it's people in private industry. It's plausible some aspects of the Israeli government also have a hand in this stuff, but I think it's explainable without that as well. NSO Group, the firm mentioned in this and other articles, and firms like Black Cube (hired by Harvey Wein…

s/some people accused/lawsuit was put against/g

Re: Undercover spy exposed in NYC was one of many

#50

Post by avip »

baybal2 wrote: post #47
inglor wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not sure why this is downvoted - this is absolutely true. NSO is a private company who is US owned and at odds with the Israeli government often. As an Israeli I’m pretty confident Israel would not send spies in order to do things related to NSO’s private business. If anything - these are US spies and not Israeli ones. It just doesn’t make sense for Israel to do this. Not that Israel doesn’t do shabby spywork or…

> NSO is a private company who is US owned and at odds with the Israeli government often. But is stuffed full of ex-officers from Israel's military. Don't you find it odd? Why they seem to keep coming, while at the same time switching back and forth in between army and "civilian" career? That's a rather dumb cover.

Is this a serious question? It's like asking why would Lockheed Martin be employing US veterans.
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