Live data from Hacker News

Rising Waters Are Drowning Amtrak's Northeast Corridor

bloomberg.com

41–50 of 181 posts

Re: Rising Waters Are Drowning Amtrak's Northeast Corridor

#41

I was on a road trip throughout a lot of different parts of America last month. A park ranger in Big Bend told me that a tributary creek of the Rio Grande was a hundred feet wide, when normally you can just jump over it. A lakeside highway rest area in North Carolina was flooded up to a permanently mounted bench and trash can.

Huh? Big bend is nowhere near sea level..

Re: Rising Waters Are Drowning Amtrak's Northeast Corridor

#42
post #8

> The report’s authors estimated the initial cost of protecting the study area to be $78 million, based on the premise that water levels around Wilmington would rise 2 feet by 2050. That's a drop in the bucket compared to Amtrak's $38 billion maintenance backlog or the $13 billion Hudson tunnel project. Out of all the potential effects of climate change, this seems like one of the least worrisome -- we even know how…

>this seems like one of the least worrisome -- we even know how to fix it already! The biggest struggle with climate change (in the US at least) is trying to convince businesses that they're going to be impacted financially. If anything we need more industry-specific reporting to try to show companies how ignoring climate change will impact their bottom line.

I don't think it matters if you show businesses that climate will impact them financially. The people running the show may not be running it when the financial burden actually comes around.

If there is no impact or very little for the person/people currently running the business, then there is no reason to make a move to prevent/mitigate the problem.

Re: Rising Waters Are Drowning Amtrak's Northeast Corridor

#43

> Water levels around Wilmington would rise 2 feet by 2050. That reflects the median of possible warming scenarios 2 feet is the median!? And things continue to accelerate? I thought I followed climate change issues but somehow did not know that in most people's lifetimes sea levels will rise multiple feet. I would've thought folks would be more... concerned? The maps of New Jersey, New York, and Connecticut look lik…

When people talk about sea level rise, they usually mean the global average sea level, or the change in total amount of liquid water in the ocean. When talking about local sea level rise, they usually mean the change in maximum high tide. Given all the unique coastlines, gravitational/water tides, and temperature differences, an average global sea rise means different things to different regions.

A shallow bay in the tropics that is right in the way of ocean currents, for example, can see an order of magnitude more change in high tide than the global sea level, let alone during surges and swells.

Re: Rising Waters Are Drowning Amtrak's Northeast Corridor

#44
post #34
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know about sea level rise prediction accuracy, but temperature "hindcasts" hold up pretty well: https://www.carbonbrief.org/analysis-how-well-have-climate-m...

It is astounding how spot on it has all been. The data is so crystal clear.

I keep seeing charts that say otherwise: https://cei.org/sites/default/files/Figure%201.JPG . This suggests the models are not accurate.

Who is right?

Re: Rising Waters Are Drowning Amtrak's Northeast Corridor

#45
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the Bay Area today, a section of Amtrak's Capital Corridor passes through the salt ponds and the Baylands marshes which is also quite reminiscent.

the California reference document on this topic might be .. a 71 page April 2017 pdf .. "Rising Seas in California -- an Update on Sea-Level Rise Science" through California OPC_SAT

Link: http://www.opc.ca.gov/webmaster/ftp/pdf/docs/rising-seas-in-...

It's a few pages before it becomes California-specific.

Re: Rising Waters Are Drowning Amtrak's Northeast Corridor

#46
post #35
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've only used it on the west coast, but it seems like the service, cleanliness, etc. are comparable to European and Asian trains, but because the Amtrak trains are super slow and the distances here are so much greater, riding anywhere on it is a terrible experience. Not to mention the fact that it's almost as expensive as flying. (Just checked and it would cost me $79 to fly to Portland from Seattle and $53 to take…

Don't forget to add airport overhead and potentially the time it takes to get to airport over train station (if you live in the city), getting through security, boarding the plane, waiting to depart, etc. Might not even be a time savings when it's all said and done. For me, living in Boston, going to NYC on the NEC a lot, I still prefer the train, even though it's expensive (I just went to NYC for thanksgiving), some…

The Northeast corridor is one thing, but the rest of the country has an entirely different experience with Amtrak. I once took a train from Pittsburgh to Chicago which was scheduled to depart at 8 AM. Instead we ended up boarding at noon, and apparently this is a completely typical delay. I hate airports, but the unimaginable volatility of Amtrak will more than erase the benefit of not trudging through airport security, as well as make it impossible to schedule any connecting transport at your destination.

As for the view, the California Zephyr is indeed breathtaking between Denver and Reno, but prepare to spend a night sleeping in your seat or on the floor of a rattling traincar (sleeper cabins exist, sure... for ten times the price of flying).

Re: Rising Waters Are Drowning Amtrak's Northeast Corridor

#47

As a very frequent Amtrak rider, I’m pretty conflicted here. On one hand, climate change is bad. On the other hand, giving the Amtrak fleet a bath, or altogether destroying it sounds pretty good to me.

It was mostly a joke, I ride the Amtrak multiple times per month. It's pretty awful. Unless you're taking the Acela you need to budget 2+ hours for the inevitable delays.

On the NE Regional, I'm delayed 1/3 trips at least.

Re: Rising Waters Are Drowning Amtrak's Northeast Corridor

#48
post #44
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is astounding how spot on it has all been. The data is so crystal clear.

I keep seeing charts that say otherwise: https://cei.org/sites/default/files/Figure%201.JPG . This suggests the models are not accurate. Who is right?

Certainly not the CEI's (Competitive Enterprise Institute) who distributed your figure. They have a long history of spreading disinformation, going back to the fight over tobacco policy: https://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php/Competitive_Enterprise...

Re: Rising Waters Are Drowning Amtrak's Northeast Corridor

#49

Blessing in disguise here for Amtrack and a great opportunity to do an overhaul of a subset of the one of the oldest railroad infrastructure in the USA. Many lessons we can learn from European counterparts.

It's not easy to move a rail line. It's politically and economically infeasible. Amtrak hugs the coast in the northeast in part because that land is useless for anything else. Much like the subways, bridges, tunnels, roads, and every other piece of transit infrastructure in the northeast, the rail problems are systemic and it's a huge effort just to keep things moving at all. This isn't a blessing; it's a snapshot of one of dozens of problems that are just as urgently in need of investment.

Re: Rising Waters Are Drowning Amtrak's Northeast Corridor

#50
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is that a no-brainer? In Seattle, first you have to get to the airport. Sea-Tac isn't exactly in Seattle. Depending on where you're coming from, King Street may be easier to reach. Then there's the bit about arriving at the airport 2 hours before, in order to pass through security. Yeah, you can probably cheat on the two hours, depending on how long security lines tend to be at Sea-Tac. Still, it's a chunk of tim…

One major downside is that the schedule is very unpredictable between Portland and Seattle, due to right of way being preempted by freight traffic. It's not uncommon to have to pull into a siding and sit for 10-20 minutes several times. That said the comfort between train and air travel is night and day, you get much more space, plenty of outlets, room to get up and move around, purchase food and drinks, even if the…

The food is worse than airline food? Wow. Is that even possible?
Post reply on HN