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Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

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Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#41

Post by makewavesnotwar »

Sure and while you're at it why not implement cameras all over every roadway to automatically ticket you every time you break the speed limit. Or better yet, why not devise a real time geolocation device to be embedded in cars and then lobby for it to be nationally adopted so people literally can't speed?

The reality is that very few people want to live in that world and even if we do fully adopt technologies like this, it doesn't necessarily make us any safer. A car traveling 30 mph is absolutely as lethal as a car traveling 10 mph faster than that. And I'm much more likely to be killed by a random traffic accident (only time I've been hit on my bike was by a white women driving a Ford) or domestic terrorist/psychopath than an immigrant.

So you're pitching huge lifestyle and diplomatic costs without any obvious benefit... Please count me as a no.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#42

Post by tinktank »

AngryData wrote: post #31
_iyig wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Illegal immigrants are by definition disenfranchised. They are not citizens, so they do not get the franchise, which is the right to vote. That’s as it should be according to the U.S. Constitution, and the basic law of (nearly?) every democracy.

Where does it say that foreigners can't vote in the constitution? Up until the 20th century the only requirement to vote in most states was residency, not citizenship. Many places only required 6 months stay to vote no matter who or where you were from, others required a commitment to long-term residency. It wasn't until women's and black's voting rights started becoming a popular issue that voting was redefined to m…

Wow, that's an interesting point. The UK will still allow commonwealth and EU citizens to vote in some elections but the Turdy's (Tory's) are trying to get the laws changed to prevent that for precisely the same reason you state.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#44

Post by taneq »

ozgurozkan wrote: post #33

Don’t Worry!!! Face recog startup founder here. Amazon’s tech only allows them to monitor a specific people list in real time. So search period should be limited. Otherwise it’s so expensive to do that. It only tracks for specific target list on real time cameras or photos. When it comes to searching on archives Amazon is so expensive to do it. As Reminisce Inc we are a photo delivery company. We have a face search t…

> However we use our tech only to deliver souvenir photography to event attendees. We will not sell it to government.

Do you have a warrant canary or similar in place?

How hard is it to defeat the "live face" thing and get your system to search for someone else using a photo or something? Could I use a video of someone I want to track?

I'm just playing devil's advocate here. Your service and tech looks awesome if you continue to provide it ethically, it just seems like there are a bunch of ways that services of this kind could be exploited.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#45

Post by hardwaresofton »

wangyjx wrote: post #43

If not Amazon, another company will do business with gov. Face recognition is mature enough, there is no very high barrier. Even if US gov doesnt adopt such technology, another gov will do and already done. It is just business.

So I'm not sure 100% where I stand morally on the "if not us then someone else" argument as whole but I'm pretty sure it's better to just not let that person/entity be you (in this case Amazon), and figuring it out from there.

Even if the world is lacking in your brand of ethics/morals doesn't mean you need to stoop to the same level as someone who doesn't hold the same brand of ethics/morals.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#46

Post by ardy42 »

wangyjx wrote: post #43

If not Amazon, another company will do business with gov. Face recognition is mature enough, there is no very high barrier. Even if US gov doesnt adopt such technology, another gov will do and already done. It is just business.

> If not Amazon, another company will do business with gov. Face recognition is mature enough, there is no very high barrier. Even if US gov doesnt adopt such technology, another gov will do.

> It is just business.

Guns are a mature technology, and pretty easy to use. If I don't do the hit for Vinny, some other hitman will, so I might as well make some cash. It is just business.

The fact that someone else may perform a morally dubious action if you don't does not provide any justification for you to perform that action.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#47

Post by noobermin »

tinktank wrote: post #30
noobermin wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I made a comment below about how does this violate privacy rights? I think we all feel at a certain level, making it easier to identify people feels unnatural and unnerving, may be because for long swaths of history we had a certain level of anonymity just by the nature of reality. Should that be something that is our right? Does that mean we should explicitly impede the efficiency of the government in doing things l…

Nowhere in my previous comment does it say that I'm opposed to lack of privacy in public so I'm not sure how to respond to your comment -- that's not my issue. My issue is that someone shouldn't be targeted for monitoring on the basis of their immigration status. Either do it for everyone or nobody. If you're going to do it for everyone, then have a technical framework in place to ensure (to the best of our ability t…

I agree with you on the monitoring bit. That is a bigger question, more important question is who could the state monitor without a warrant. I guess the nuance is that this tech is not about surveillance/monitoring but it is about identification. Of course, that implies that one had to get the picture in the first place, which brings up that question about who could the state monitor, but I guess that's separate question from whether this tech is good or bad.

As for the mask deal, I agree with you, that someone has a right to obscure their identity if they want to.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#48

Post by LyndsySimon »

ridgeguy wrote: post #29
noobermin wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do people have a right to not be identified in public? In public, your right to privacy doesn't protect you from having your picture being taken. Then, what if someone identifies you from your picture? How about if they use a CV system to speed it up? What's the argument here? BTW, as I expand upon below, I'm against surveillance of private communications, I think we all are. As far as I understand it, this is not su…

Scale matters. If it were only warm-blooded individual humans identifying you, there wouldn't be much potential for abuse. In the 1960s, your privacy was pretty much preserved even in public spaces. Unless you were a genuine person of interest, worthy of expending costly observational resources. Now? Drive anywhere, walk anywhere - machines log your travels. It's a perfect recipe for abuse. Just scale, is all it take…

The poison is in the dose.

Re: Amazon Pitches Facial Recognition to Monitor Immigrants

#50

Post by hkjayakumar »

makewavesnotwar wrote: post #41

Sure and while you're at it why not implement cameras all over every roadway to automatically ticket you every time you break the speed limit. Or better yet, why not devise a real time geolocation device to be embedded in cars and then lobby for it to be nationally adopted so people literally can't speed? The reality is that very few people want to live in that world and even if we do fully adopt technologies like th…

> Sure and while you're at it why not implement cameras all over every roadway to automatically ticket you every time you break the speed limit.

This actually exists in many cities around the world like Dubai. Probably not every roadway, but almost all major ones.

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