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Apple now strives to design and build products that last as long as possible

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Re: Apple now strives to design and build products that last as long as possible

#41

Post by vbezhenar »

sokoloff wrote: post #20
beloch wrote: post #12

You know what helps products last longer and reduces waste at the same time? Repairability . The repairability of apple products is so poor that even Apple can't fix most of their own products without replacing surprisingly large portions of any given Apple device. End user repairability has been utterly neglected. Disassembly is frequently impossible without causing damage, and components such as batteries are frequ…

> How easy is it for end-users to replace the battery in that off-warranty 5S? Oh. I see. I did it in about 45 minutes the first time, and could do another in 20-30 minutes pretty easily. It's now a 5-year old phone. 10 minutes labor per year is OK in my book. How easy is it for end-users to replace the clutch in that off-warranty Civic? For that matter, how many people even change their own brakes (one of the easies…

> I did it in about 45 minutes the first time, and could do another in 20-30 minutes pretty easily.

Does it work with recent water-proof phones? I thought that there's some kind of glue to protect from water.

Re: Apple now strives to design and build products that last as long as possible

#42

Post by kgermino »

hjek wrote: post #2

> After a long life of use, ensure that they are recycled properly. Anyone ever read about Apple's must-shred agreement[0] with recyclers? Is that what "properly" refers to here? > Ensure that Apple products last as long as possible. Anyone read about Apple's recent lawsuit[1] for planned obsolescence in iPhones? [0]: https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/yp73jw/apple-recy... [1]: https://www.commondreams.org/ne…

[1] badly misrepresents what happened. Throttling peak performance when the battery can’t deliver enough power for it helps people use the phone longer. It’s almost the opposite of planned obsolescence. The alternative is people’s phone shuts down randomly, which is definitely more likely to push them into replacing it. It also is fixed after the battery is replaced.

Unless you mean that the battery gettin old is planned obsolescence. But that’s not a great arguement either. Batteries are a wear item, and will need to be replaced if you want to use the device more than a couple years.

Re: Apple now strives to design and build products that last as long as possible

#43

Post by donkeyd »

ashleyn wrote: post #4
hjek wrote: post #2

> After a long life of use, ensure that they are recycled properly. Anyone ever read about Apple's must-shred agreement[0] with recyclers? Is that what "properly" refers to here? > Ensure that Apple products last as long as possible. Anyone read about Apple's recent lawsuit[1] for planned obsolescence in iPhones? [0]: https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/yp73jw/apple-recy... [1]: https://www.commondreams.org/ne…

The original iPad also had OS updates discontinued incredibly quickly.

The title of the article is:

> Apple now strives to [...]

It's not really fair to drag in an 8 year old product.

Re: Apple now strives to design and build products that last as long as possible

#44

Post by ataturk »

beloch wrote: post #12

You know what helps products last longer and reduces waste at the same time? Repairability . The repairability of apple products is so poor that even Apple can't fix most of their own products without replacing surprisingly large portions of any given Apple device. End user repairability has been utterly neglected. Disassembly is frequently impossible without causing damage, and components such as batteries are frequ…

I could not agree more. It is so frustrating to have a device like my iPad Air 2 sitting unused because the screen got cracked. The cost to repair it was higher than replacement cost.

If we care about the environment even one single little bit repairability should be on everyone's priority list.

I'm sure the sleek new $1100 iPhones that came out last week are even worse.

Re: Apple now strives to design and build products that last as long as possible

#45

Post by gabriel34 »

EZ-E wrote: post #21

Real talk here : what makes an iPhone slow after 2 years? - the battery aging? - the apps using more ressources than before? - the newer OS version using more ressources than before? I've started using my old Android phone again after it being unused 3 years (Nexus 4), the apps are extremely slow now, the camera takes forever to open : what's going on? Computers don't age as much

I don't see why the battery would matter, unless you are forced to use power saving performance throttling.

Flash memory degradation may be a factor, as well as increased expectations.

Also, the perceived value of the product doesn't increase much if the device lasts longer than some average lifespan. For smartphones I believe after 1-2 years most users move onto a newer device, any cost that increases the life of the device past this point is wasted and will result in a more expensive, less competitive product, so market forces push for decisions that may be perceived as planed obsolescence.

Re: Apple now strives to design and build products that last as long as possible

#46

Post by hellweaver666 »

jhokanson wrote: post #28

Has the iPhone screen durability improved at all? It seems like they are (or were?) extremely susceptible to damage from dropping and I always took that as a sign that Apple wanted to force people to upgrade. Edit: Here's a link discussing the issue: https://www.fastcompany.com/3063238/why-wont-apple-fix-the-i...

I would argue yes... they keep on improving the materials in every generation. I have a 7+ and my kid has thrown it across the room multiple times and dropped it onto a wooden floor more times than I can remember and even on concrete a couple of times. Each time my heart is in my mouth but each time it comes up without a scratch.

Re: Apple now strives to design and build products that last as long as possible

#47

Post by sokoloff »

vbezhenar wrote: post #41
sokoloff wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How easy is it for end-users to replace the battery in that off-warranty 5S? Oh. I see. I did it in about 45 minutes the first time, and could do another in 20-30 minutes pretty easily. It's now a 5-year old phone. 10 minutes labor per year is OK in my book. How easy is it for end-users to replace the clutch in that off-warranty Civic? For that matter, how many people even change their own brakes (one of the easies…

> I did it in about 45 minutes the first time, and could do another in 20-30 minutes pretty easily. Does it work with recent water-proof phones? I thought that there's some kind of glue to protect from water.

I don't know, but I do know that if the phone was covered under Apple's $29 (parts and labor) battery program, I'd go that way for sure.

https://support.apple.com/iphone/repair/battery-power

Re: Apple now strives to design and build products that last as long as possible

#48

Post by satysin »

beloch wrote: post #12

You know what helps products last longer and reduces waste at the same time? Repairability . The repairability of apple products is so poor that even Apple can't fix most of their own products without replacing surprisingly large portions of any given Apple device. End user repairability has been utterly neglected. Disassembly is frequently impossible without causing damage, and components such as batteries are frequ…

Apple have done a great job with iOS 12 on older hardware.

I have an iPhone 5S and it runs much better with iOS 12 than it did with iOS 10 or 11. The UI is faster and smoother, apps load quicker, battery life is still decent. In many ways it makes it feel like a new phone.

Re: Apple now strives to design and build products that last as long as possible

#49

Post by crispyambulance »

Sure they do.... NOT!

I'll believe THAT when it's possible to replace the battery without dealing with microscopic screws, glue, heat guns, and hard-to-source clippy thingamajigs that require super-human dexterity to install.

Re: Apple now strives to design and build products that last as long as possible

#50

Post by bayindirh »

EZ-E wrote: post #21

Real talk here : what makes an iPhone slow after 2 years? - the battery aging? - the apps using more ressources than before? - the newer OS version using more ressources than before? I've started using my old Android phone again after it being unused 3 years (Nexus 4), the apps are extremely slow now, the camera takes forever to open : what's going on? Computers don't age as much

Run a benchmark on it and compare the numbers. If they are on par with the results obtained when the device was new, maybe your expectations have changed.
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