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What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

money.cnn.com

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Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The gist of this article was not that the original report was "something fake" the scientist "cooked up". It was that the scientist received funding from an interested party that he failed to disclose. While it is true that in the realm of pure logical discourse this fact is irrelevant to the argumentative structure of the original paper, in the real world it is a significant fact that legitimately questions the cred…

The credibility of the author is relevant to the author's argument/results/conclusions to the extent that the argument depends on points whose plausibility requires faith in the author's honesty and ability. For example, suppose my thesis is, "Running the Miller-Rabin test with a=2 is sufficient to determine primality for all numbers up to 2047." If my argument is, "I have verified this myself", then my argument depe…

> The credibility of the author is relevant to the author's argument/results/conclusions to the extent that the argument depends on points whose plausibility requires faith in the author's honesty and ability.

Unless you personally have invested the time and effort needed to evaluate his research, you're stuck listening to the people who have. And unless they're all saying the same thing, you have to look at credentials, reputation, and motivation to decide who to believe. While these factors don't affect the quality of his thesis, they do affect it's believability to the rest of us.

In the real world.

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#42
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That pattern of behavior is treated unfairly, though. He argued for one theory, did a study, and then published a paper with a very different direction. That's how it's supposed to work. You change your mind as the facts come in. The article treats this as a betrayal.

That is how the pattern is supposed to work (opinion informed by data), I agree. However, credibility can be called into question by the appearance of impropriety. Perhaps one could say that the appearance of impropriety increases the prior likelihood of actual impropriety, but it's not black and white. This article is serving as a counterbalance to a NYT article that failed to disclose this author's relationship wit…

Another important point is that it sounds like the scientist's own company would also benefit extensively from the bee problem being disease rather than pesticides. As you say, this may not invalidate his results but it does mean they probably need further scrutiny.

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#43
post #36
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You make a very good point. However your point is not politically correct therefore it is being buries. Have an upvote. I find the fact that people who make valid points that don't happen to be in lock step with party ideology are buried on this site very tragic and it has significantly reduced my interest in participating in this site. Particularly ironic is that the ideological downvoting always seems to come from…

He's not being downvoted for being un-PC, he's being downvoted for being reflexively paranoid, in a style that resists falsification and contributes nothing to the discussion.

[deleted]

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#44
post #8
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Resist complaining about being downmodded. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading. http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Hint: resist lecturing people as though you own the place when your account is 10 days old.

[deleted]

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#45
post #8
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Resist complaining about being downmodded. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading. http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Hint: resist lecturing people as though you own the place when your account is 10 days old.

[deleted]

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#46
post #7

It seemed rather apparent to me that something was missing from that other article - like more insight into the underlying causes. Its reaffirming to see that Dr. Jennifer Sass asks the same questions I was asking (which, incidentally I was downvoted for and 'corrected' about here on HN).

Resist complaining about being downmodded. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading. http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

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