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The San Franciso Fire Department makes its own wooden ladders by hand

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Re: The San Franciso Fire Department makes its own wooden ladders by hand

#41

Post by ra1n85 »

xienze wrote: post #36
cesarb wrote: post #19

> There's a city-specific reason why San Francisco has stuck with wood rather than swap over to metals, and the answer lies in looking up. The high-voltage cables and wires that guide the city's (oft-maligned) public transport system Muni, and trolley cars crisscross above nearly every street, mean that ladders made of conductive elements are generally just too dangerous to use. I wonder how it's done in European cit…

Fiberglass, probably. Which is what SF should be doing.

Most ladders are fiber glass - which makes me wonder why any off the shelf ladder wouldn't suffice.

Re: The San Franciso Fire Department makes its own wooden ladders by hand

#42

Post by Retric »

heartbreak wrote: post #26
Retric wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The San Franciso Fire Department is using wooden ladders due to an abundance of overhead power lines. Which I think is the core issue, use other peoples tools unless you have some critical and unique requirement.

They could buy wooden ladders, so I don't think that paints the whole picture.

> They could buy wooden ladders

Can you point me to someplace selling 50' wooden ladders appropriate for firefighting?

Re: The San Franciso Fire Department makes its own wooden ladders by hand

#43

Post by Naritai »

lisper wrote: post #22
mindcrime wrote: post #8

There's an old saying among firefighters: "The fire service is 200+ years of tradition, unimpeded by progress". Now obviously that isn't strictly true, and SF does have some good reasons for sticking with their wooden ladders... but one can't help but suspect that sheer tradition is a somewhat significant factor. Of course some departments adopt change faster than others, and some kinds of change are adopted more rea…

> one can't help but suspect that sheer tradition is a somewhat significant factor Only if you didn't read the article. "There's a city-specific reason why San Francisco has stuck with wood rather than swap over to metals, and the answer lies in looking up. The high-voltage cables and wires that guide the city's (oft-maligned) public transport system Muni, and trolley cars crisscross above nearly every street, mean t…

It doesn't explain why they couldn't just buy wooden or fiberglass ladders though. I'm sure there are many vendors who would be happy to fill such a contract.

Re: The San Franciso Fire Department makes its own wooden ladders by hand

#44

Post by bluGill »

lisper wrote: post #22
mindcrime wrote: post #8

There's an old saying among firefighters: "The fire service is 200+ years of tradition, unimpeded by progress". Now obviously that isn't strictly true, and SF does have some good reasons for sticking with their wooden ladders... but one can't help but suspect that sheer tradition is a somewhat significant factor. Of course some departments adopt change faster than others, and some kinds of change are adopted more rea…

> one can't help but suspect that sheer tradition is a somewhat significant factor Only if you didn't read the article. "There's a city-specific reason why San Francisco has stuck with wood rather than swap over to metals, and the answer lies in looking up. The high-voltage cables and wires that guide the city's (oft-maligned) public transport system Muni, and trolley cars crisscross above nearly every street, mean t…

There are plenty of ladders on the market that are non-conductive. None of them are wood because wood is conductive. (though wood does have some interesting fire properties that probably make them better anyway)

Re: The San Franciso Fire Department makes its own wooden ladders by hand

#45

Post by maxerickson »

lisper wrote: post #22
mindcrime wrote: post #8

There's an old saying among firefighters: "The fire service is 200+ years of tradition, unimpeded by progress". Now obviously that isn't strictly true, and SF does have some good reasons for sticking with their wooden ladders... but one can't help but suspect that sheer tradition is a somewhat significant factor. Of course some departments adopt change faster than others, and some kinds of change are adopted more rea…

> one can't help but suspect that sheer tradition is a somewhat significant factor Only if you didn't read the article. "There's a city-specific reason why San Francisco has stuck with wood rather than swap over to metals, and the answer lies in looking up. The high-voltage cables and wires that guide the city's (oft-maligned) public transport system Muni, and trolley cars crisscross above nearly every street, mean t…

What kind of ladders do the power line companies use?

Re: The San Franciso Fire Department makes its own wooden ladders by hand

#46

Post by madengr »

Retric wrote: post #9
legitster wrote: post #2

If you get a chance to visit a Smokejumper base, I highly recommend it. One of the things you learn is that everyone on the team is required to make all of their own equipment by hand. So all of these highly trained, ex-military guys spend days on end doing nothing but sewing clothes and packing parachutes. The reasons described: - Cheaper than contracting out everything - They have a better idea of the exact specifi…

The San Franciso Fire Department is using wooden ladders due to an abundance of overhead power lines. Which I think is the core issue, use other peoples tools unless you have some critical and unique requirement.

So I wonder why fiberglass ladders are not used?

Re: The San Franciso Fire Department makes its own wooden ladders by hand

#47

Post by bluGill »

xienze wrote: post #36
cesarb wrote: post #19

> There's a city-specific reason why San Francisco has stuck with wood rather than swap over to metals, and the answer lies in looking up. The high-voltage cables and wires that guide the city's (oft-maligned) public transport system Muni, and trolley cars crisscross above nearly every street, mean that ladders made of conductive elements are generally just too dangerous to use. I wonder how it's done in European cit…

Fiberglass, probably. Which is what SF should be doing.

How does fiberglass stand to high heat?

Re: The San Franciso Fire Department makes its own wooden ladders by hand

#48

Post by maxerickson »

ra1n85 wrote: post #41
xienze wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fiberglass, probably. Which is what SF should be doing.

Most ladders are fiber glass - which makes me wonder why any off the shelf ladder wouldn't suffice.

In my experience aluminum is more common than fiberglass.

Re: The San Franciso Fire Department makes its own wooden ladders by hand

#50

Post by LeifCarrotson »

lisper wrote: post #22
mindcrime wrote: post #8

There's an old saying among firefighters: "The fire service is 200+ years of tradition, unimpeded by progress". Now obviously that isn't strictly true, and SF does have some good reasons for sticking with their wooden ladders... but one can't help but suspect that sheer tradition is a somewhat significant factor. Of course some departments adopt change faster than others, and some kinds of change are adopted more rea…

> one can't help but suspect that sheer tradition is a somewhat significant factor Only if you didn't read the article. "There's a city-specific reason why San Francisco has stuck with wood rather than swap over to metals, and the answer lies in looking up. The high-voltage cables and wires that guide the city's (oft-maligned) public transport system Muni, and trolley cars crisscross above nearly every street, mean t…

And only if you're also about 40 years behind ladder tech - notice the stepladders in the "A view of the main repair facility" photo?

They're nonconductive fiberglass.

They're stronger than wood, lighter than wood, don't need to be oiled/varnished, don't require cutting down old-growth trees, and aren't susceptible to moisture damage.

You can buy them exhaustively tested, mass produced, in whatever quantities you require for a couple hundred dollars - probably an order of magnitude less than these artisanal wooden ladders.

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