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Apple Will Start Paying Back Taxes to Irish Government Next Month

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Re: Apple Will Start Paying Back Taxes to Irish Government Next Month

#41

Post by mickronome »

stingrae wrote: post #33
oculusthrift wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don’t really get people who defend mega corporations. They played the game and they lost. They should’ve known that the rules can change, especially if someone is cheating or gaming the system.

Where is the evidence that they were cheating the system. Ireland created tax laws, to incentivize companies to come. The European commission comes in and decides that Ireland needs to revert laws that have been on the books for years and collect back taxes on it. This is absurd. How can a company plan for all the potential laws that Europe could reverse. Luckily in Apple's case, they have the funds to pay.

Eeasy, given the politics and history of the region in question, anyone in the relevant positions knew Ireland tax break was a long term risk, but worth it short term. Chasing tax breaks is always a gamble.

Re: Apple Will Start Paying Back Taxes to Irish Government Next Month

#42

Post by handelaar »

stingrae wrote: post #33
oculusthrift wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don’t really get people who defend mega corporations. They played the game and they lost. They should’ve known that the rules can change, especially if someone is cheating or gaming the system.

Where is the evidence that they were cheating the system. Ireland created tax laws, to incentivize companies to come. The European commission comes in and decides that Ireland needs to revert laws that have been on the books for years and collect back taxes on it. This is absurd. How can a company plan for all the potential laws that Europe could reverse. Luckily in Apple's case, they have the funds to pay.

No.

Corporation Tax in Ireland is 12.5%. Europe is insisting only that Ireland actually collects it. If, as alleged, someone in Fianna Fail made a deal with Apple thirty years ago to charge it, and it alone, a different rate? It's not on the statute book, the power to do that is not included in law, and therefore it's Not A Thing. Oh, and also someone committed a serious crime, but it's Ireland and they'll never be prosecuted.

Re: Apple Will Start Paying Back Taxes to Irish Government Next Month

#43

Post by jamesblonde »

dosycorp wrote: post #23
TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not Ireland trying to make Apple pay back-taxes! The European Commission is forcing Ireland to charge Apple them.

Come on. IE is not double dealing to the EU for a bit of kick back somehow? Of course they are. That EU is "forcing" them is hilarious. IE loves to play a fake victim if they can, and in this case, all the better to be open for business. "Oh, EU, please stop getting me to get Apple to pay me taxes. Please stop making me collect revenue." Said no state ever. But believe their fake victim tale if you want. The Irish ar…

Actually, the revenue won't end up in ireland. All member states will send a bill to ireland, and ireland will split up the money to them (based on Apple's relative sales around Europe).

Re: Apple Will Start Paying Back Taxes to Irish Government Next Month

#44

Post by gwright »

keieo29 wrote: post #29
stingrae wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He and Apple was following the law. If Europe was so angry about Ireland's tax laws they should have stopped it from taking effect in the beginning.

Life is political Tim Cook knows all about “optics” It’s rather ignorant and selfish for him to pretend laws shouldn’t change or should only favor him It’s the social equivalent of building on a Google svc and having them shut down that service QQ for Tim Cook but it’s well within the authority of the government in question Poor billionaire snowflake Maybe he can do like Thiel and invest in undermining public institu…

There is a difference between the laws changing and affecting future behavior and a change being applied retroactively.

An earlier message indicated that the money was being put in escrow because apparently there is still a dispute about how the law should have been applied in the past.

I think it is reasonable to be upset about after-the-fact changes to the application of a law/regulation.

Re: Apple Will Start Paying Back Taxes to Irish Government Next Month

#45

Post by dosycorp »

jamesblonde wrote: post #43
dosycorp wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Come on. IE is not double dealing to the EU for a bit of kick back somehow? Of course they are. That EU is "forcing" them is hilarious. IE loves to play a fake victim if they can, and in this case, all the better to be open for business. "Oh, EU, please stop getting me to get Apple to pay me taxes. Please stop making me collect revenue." Said no state ever. But believe their fake victim tale if you want. The Irish ar…

Actually, the revenue won't end up in ireland. All member states will send a bill to ireland, and ireland will split up the money to them (based on Apple's relative sales around Europe).

That is interesting. There has to be a way that IE gets a significant cut from the Apple money tho. I'd be very surprised if there wasn't. That or in future the recompensated EU members agree to invest more in IE.

Re: Apple Will Start Paying Back Taxes to Irish Government Next Month

#47

Post by [deleted] »

pm90 wrote: post #39
stingrae wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is the evidence that they were cheating the system. Ireland created tax laws, to incentivize companies to come. The European commission comes in and decides that Ireland needs to revert laws that have been on the books for years and collect back taxes on it. This is absurd. How can a company plan for all the potential laws that Europe could reverse. Luckily in Apple's case, they have the funds to pay.

> How can a company plan for all the potential laws that Europe could reverse. Luckily in Apple's case, they have the funds to pay. They can't. The world is uncertain. Sovereign Nations legally have the power to do anything they fucking want in the regions they govern (they might be restricted by their own laws and constitution, but it is an internal one). In this case, it appears that Apple abused certain Irish tax…

[deleted]

Re: Apple Will Start Paying Back Taxes to Irish Government Next Month

#48

Post by rbanffy »

chrisseaton wrote: post #35
afarrell wrote: post #18

Hopefully they use this to build more housing.

I thought Ireland already had a huge glut of housing that nobody wanted?

Quite the contrary. There is a monumental housing shortage.

But this is not where this money will go. When all is said and done, if Apple still owes that much, it'll be divided with the rest of the EU according to Apple's sales. Thanks to its tech hubs (it seems every other person on the train is a software engineer), Ireland may end up with some part of it, but most certainly not all.

Re: Apple Will Start Paying Back Taxes to Irish Government Next Month

#49

Post by gwright »

oculusthrift wrote: post #28
stingrae wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He and Apple was following the law. If Europe was so angry about Ireland's tax laws they should have stopped it from taking effect in the beginning.

Don’t really get people who defend mega corporations. They played the game and they lost. They should’ve known that the rules can change, especially if someone is cheating or gaming the system.

Because it isn't about defending "mega corporations" it is about the general principle that the legal interpretations (or new legislation/regulations) shouldn't be applied retroactively.

It is one thing to change the interpretation and use that going forward. Completely different to change the interpretation and apply it retroactively.

Re: Apple Will Start Paying Back Taxes to Irish Government Next Month

#50

Post by rbanffy »

dosycorp wrote: post #45
jamesblonde wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, the revenue won't end up in ireland. All member states will send a bill to ireland, and ireland will split up the money to them (based on Apple's relative sales around Europe).

That is interesting. There has to be a way that IE gets a significant cut from the Apple money tho. I'd be very surprised if there wasn't. That or in future the recompensated EU members agree to invest more in IE.

I assume Apple sells a lot here - the tech community, at least in Dublin, is enormous and Apple seems to be extremely popular among geeks, which, it seems, are a sizeable part of the overall population.
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