Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Facebook to ask everyone to accept being tracked so they can keep using it

independent.co.uk

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 162 posts

Re: Facebook to ask everyone to accept being tracked so they can keep using it

#41

Post by fancyfacebook »

d6de964 wrote: post #21

Google already does this anytime I clear my cookies. Why would they allow someone using the service if they didn't get something back?

Some of us are old enough to remember the web and other services before they had ads. I remember quite well when the first started showing up, people called them "banners", and it was infuriating.

I never accepted the change in the expectation that everything will now be ad supported. That's a fundamental, massive shift. You can still say no that imposition, it's not actually baked into any of the technology, just a bunch of bloat glued on afterwards.

Re: Facebook to ask everyone to accept being tracked so they can keep using it

#42

Post by stan_rogers »

matty22 wrote: post #28
drb91 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

uBlock Origin makes the ads go away pretty well. I'm also open to paying.

Does uBlock Origin actually have any effect on ads or sponsored posts in Facebook? I run ABP and there are still ads all over the place in Facebook. I've taken to reporting every ad I see in my Timeline as spam.

Fluff Busting Purity (formerly Facebook Purity). Nukes everything; maintainer is hugely on the ball, rolling out fixes for FB's breaking bugs within hours (and occasionally within minutes). If it's not in your browser's extensions/addons "store", you can find it at https://www.fbpurity.com/

Re: Facebook to ask everyone to accept being tracked so they can keep using it

#43

Post by sverige »

Silhouette wrote: post #20
downandout wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can already see it on many sites. They're basically just a more forceful version of cookie notifications with language about third party tracking thrown in that force you to say "OK" or tell you to leave. Here's an example: http://prntscr.com/j67usw FB, as with all third party trackers, isn't the one actually responsible for notifying you about the use of their pixels etc. on third party sites. The site operator…

One of the main points of the GDPR is that this sort of treatment is unlikely to be legal any more, to the extent that it ever was. Processing based on consent is now going to require active consent that can't be opted-in by default or hidden away in legal wording no-one ever reads. It's going to be tough to argue that tracking someone who isn't connected to your business/organisation has any of the acceptable bases…

I wonder how many companies are waiting to see how this will be enforced before making the change. If GDPR is really actively enforced and causes some real pain to companies, then I expect your prediction will be accurate. If it isn't, I expect a lot of sites will do something less than what GDPR says.

Re: Facebook to ask everyone to accept being tracked so they can keep using it

#44

Post by downandout »

Silhouette wrote: post #20
downandout wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can already see it on many sites. They're basically just a more forceful version of cookie notifications with language about third party tracking thrown in that force you to say "OK" or tell you to leave. Here's an example: http://prntscr.com/j67usw FB, as with all third party trackers, isn't the one actually responsible for notifying you about the use of their pixels etc. on third party sites. The site operator…

One of the main points of the GDPR is that this sort of treatment is unlikely to be legal any more, to the extent that it ever was. Processing based on consent is now going to require active consent that can't be opted-in by default or hidden away in legal wording no-one ever reads. It's going to be tough to argue that tracking someone who isn't connected to your business/organisation has any of the acceptable bases…

I'm curious what about that notification is "hidden away in legal wording" or doesn't "require active consent". You have to agree with it to make that go away.

Re: Facebook to ask everyone to accept being tracked so they can keep using it

#45

Post by gowld »

craftyguy wrote: post #34
epiapp wrote: post #27

My adblocker detects approximately 44 trackers on that page, including one from connect.facebook.net.

The article isn't "Independent to ask everyone to accept being tracked".

bottom of the page says:

> We use cookies to enhance your visit to our site and to bring you advertisements that might interest you. Read our Privacy and Cookie Policies to find out more.

Re: Facebook to ask everyone to accept being tracked so they can keep using it

#46

Post by downandout »

Sir_Substance wrote: post #29
downandout wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can already see it on many sites. They're basically just a more forceful version of cookie notifications with language about third party tracking thrown in that force you to say "OK" or tell you to leave. Here's an example: http://prntscr.com/j67usw FB, as with all third party trackers, isn't the one actually responsible for notifying you about the use of their pixels etc. on third party sites. The site operator…

This might not be a great long term strategy, I'm expecting one or two buzzfeed-like websites to be put up against the wall and shot over this. I've always dealt with the cookie notifications by using ublock to simply block that element, I never click "ok". I've never had a website actually stop me from using it when I do this until google changed their search page a few weeks ago. If you're running a website with on…

I've always dealt with the cookie notifications by using ublock to simply block that element, I never click "ok". I've never had a website actually stop me from using it when I do this until google changed their search page a few weeks ago.

I imagine that you simply won't be able to use websites anymore if you are from the EU and don't give consent. You'll just be told to go away.

Re: Facebook to ask everyone to accept being tracked so they can keep using it

#47

Post by maximente »

downandout wrote: post #40
maximente wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this is fundamentally insufficient, though. if there's a hosted image from a facebook domain (e.g. a like button), unless that image is loaded after consent is given, facebook can already associate that users' IP address with having visited that web site by nature of sending the image over. in other words, facebook is tracking pre-consent (unless those images are loaded post-hoc, which is just not happening in today'…

Yeah, but that's easy enough to deal with. You simply don't load any third party stuff (or allow them to see your content) until they click "OK". Some simple javascript is all it takes to delay loading of everything not on the current server. So basically prior to serving any content, you do an IP check. If they are from a GDPR country, you serve the delay loading script. If they aren't, you just load as normal. Pret…

what you've suggested seems OK technically, but i feel like you're making an assumption that originating source of traffic determines citizenship of the user.

it could very well be that an EU citizen in Asia or the US is collected upon given your algorithm. if that's the case, are you not in violation of GDPR?

but, at the risk of rabbit-holing, your suggestion would be a pretty fundamental change to how the web works. in effect, you'd be moving toward a splintered web, where content is basically region locked.

to be fair, i don't have anything else to offer here; it just doesn't seem so easy to me.

Re: Facebook to ask everyone to accept being tracked so they can keep using it

#48

Post by Sir_Substance »

downandout wrote: post #46
Sir_Substance wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This might not be a great long term strategy, I'm expecting one or two buzzfeed-like websites to be put up against the wall and shot over this. I've always dealt with the cookie notifications by using ublock to simply block that element, I never click "ok". I've never had a website actually stop me from using it when I do this until google changed their search page a few weeks ago. If you're running a website with on…

I've always dealt with the cookie notifications by using ublock to simply block that element, I never click "ok". I've never had a website actually stop me from using it when I do this until google changed their search page a few weeks ago. I imagine that you simply won't be able to use websites anymore if you are from the EU and don't give consent. You'll just be told to go away.

It's trickier than that for the website owner. EU citizens accessing websites through VPN's are still protected by GDPR.

Re: Facebook to ask everyone to accept being tracked so they can keep using it

#49

Post by downandout »

maximente wrote: post #47
downandout wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but that's easy enough to deal with. You simply don't load any third party stuff (or allow them to see your content) until they click "OK". Some simple javascript is all it takes to delay loading of everything not on the current server. So basically prior to serving any content, you do an IP check. If they are from a GDPR country, you serve the delay loading script. If they aren't, you just load as normal. Pret…

what you've suggested seems OK technically, but i feel like you're making an assumption that originating source of traffic determines citizenship of the user. it could very well be that an EU citizen in Asia or the US is collected upon given your algorithm. if that's the case, are you not in violation of GDPR? but, at the risk of rabbit-holing, your suggestion would be a pretty fundamental change to how the web works…

but, at the risk of rabbit-holing, your suggestion would be a pretty fundamental change to how the web works. in effect, you'd be moving toward a splintered web, where content is basically region locked.

I think you're spot on, but that was the danger of implementing heavy-handed legislation like GDPR all along. I believe that EU citizens are going to find themselves locked out of a whole world of content. But that's the world they've chosen to create for themselves. Further, if the overwhelming support that GDPR has on HN is representative of that of the entire EU population, they welcome this newly splintered world and its consequences - both good and bad (though I believe that this support is the product of the mistaken belief that the world will simply play ball and be dictated to by the EU, rather than the rest of the world simply taking their ball and going home).

Re: Facebook to ask everyone to accept being tracked so they can keep using it

#50

Post by muro »

matrixagent wrote: post #33
muro wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Heh, funny. Unfortunately also nonsense. A CFO also exists and not because a company doesn't handle finances responsibly. Or a CEO implies no engineering?

I think you misread. The implication was that Facebook would not exist with real privacy in the product, not the role of CPO within Facebook.

Doh. You are right. Apologies for the snark.
Post reply on HN