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Oracle set to merge Java virtual machines

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Re: Oracle set to merge Java virtual machines

#41

Post by rbanffy »

cageface wrote: post #29
lukev wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but one of the JVMs selling points is that it's attractive to both open-source hackers and heavyweight commercial users. If you fork it, then you're in essence splitting these user bases, to the great detriment of both.

Exactly. The great thing about Clojure or Scala compared to other funlangs is that I can walk into just about any big "enterprise" shop and plug transparently into their codebase and toolchain. This is a crucial adoption vector for FP and the struggles other funlangs have gone through to bootstrap themselves underlines this.

> I can walk into just about any big "enterprise" shop and plug transparently into their codebase and toolchain

What is the oldest JVM Clojure can run on? Many "big enterprises" run technology that's years behind the latest and greatest. And I have been waiting for 1.7 since the time I actually wrote Java code.

Re: Oracle set to merge Java virtual machines

#42

Post by rbanffy »

joubert wrote: post #14
rbanffy wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oracle certainly has money to throw at the problem. The question whether the problem is one that can be solved by throwing lots of money at it will be answered in 18 months.

Throwing money at it probably won't solve it.

That's my bet too. And I am quite happy with it. If Oracle completely botches their proprietary, poisonous implementation, OpenJDK may gain some popularity. The biggest risk is giving .NET a more easy market.

Re: Oracle set to merge Java virtual machines

#43

Post by michaelneale »

jjs_ wrote: post #32
ouhjygj wrote: post #26

So what would happen if a large company in Redmond hired/contracted a bunch of ex-Sun engineers to make a java->.Net compiler so all this stuff ran on the CLR As Oracle makes it harder and harder to use the JVM people are forced into the waiting arms of MSFT

http://www.ikvm.net/ ??

I am surprised how well it runs considering it is a VM in a VM.

Re: Oracle set to merge Java virtual machines

#45

Post by crpatino »

rbanffy wrote: post #38
lmz wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That might be possible (free desktop edition, limited to 2 cores and 8GB RAM?), but I can't honestly blame Oracle for wanting to make money out of Java. Sun had the COBOL of the 21st century and still failed to make much money out of it. Oracle isn't going to make the same mistake.

> Oracle isn't going to make the same mistake. And will probably kill Java in the process.

they are probably going to kill Java... in a market segment where it has been chronically ill for years.

Java Enterprise is alive and healthy, thank you very much. No reason to believe that it will not continue to do pretty good for the next decade at least.

Re: Oracle set to merge Java virtual machines

#46

Post by rbanffy »

crpatino wrote: post #45
rbanffy wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Oracle isn't going to make the same mistake. And will probably kill Java in the process.

they are probably going to kill Java... in a market segment where it has been chronically ill for years. Java Enterprise is alive and healthy, thank you very much. No reason to believe that it will not continue to do pretty good for the next decade at least.

It will enter "legacy-mode". The prophecy of Java being the 21st century COBOL will be, at last, fulfilled. Old systems will be maintained and extended as long as they remain useful. New systems will be initially deployed on those platforms but, as new programmers grow less and less familiar with them and thus costlier to train, new technologies will emerge and take its place like Java took COBOL's (at least part of it).

All of this happened before, and it will happen again.

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