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Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers are pulling out

business.financialpost.com

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Re: Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers are pulling out

#41

Post by symlinkk »

jlmorton wrote: post #21
reaperducer wrote: post #14

Perhaps some good will come out of all this. Maybe in the future, when some PHB asks development to add a questionable data gathering function to a platform they can say, "Remember Facebook?"

Facebook runs a messaging service with ~1.2 billion monthly active users. One of the core features of the product is to integrate with other contacts on your phone, and you have to explicitly enable this feature, agreeing to "ongoing upload" of your "text and call history". Apple runs a messaging service called iMessage. It logs all of your call metadata, SMS history, etc. There is no opt-in, it's just default behavi…

> you have to explicitly enable this feature, agreeing to "ongoing upload" of your "text and call history"

I don't remember this being explicitly asked of me in any obvious way. And even if it was, I would have assumed they only needed that permission to get a list of contacts on my phone, and that the rest of it would be unused.

> Apple runs a messaging service called iMessage

Yes, and it's all encrypted and none of it is sent to third-party advertisers or creepy voter manipulation firms.

> Facebook has never sold this data. There is no evidence they've even used the data for anything except its explicitly-stated purpose.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/19/technology/facebook-cambr...

Re: Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers are pulling out

#42

Post by radicalbyte »

goalieca wrote: post #34
juicy-fruit wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Less top talent will want to be associated with facebook How certain is this? Whether you like what Facebook does or not, you can't deny their engineering talent is top tier. I don't even use Facebook but I'd still want to work there just to work with the people there and the environment. Companies like Facebook and Google are pretty engineer friendly, more so than other companies. I don't think this event will be t…

If facebook’s engineering talent is top tier, then how come I have to recommend to everyone to delete that awful battery draining app.

It takes some amazing engineering talent to build an app which drains your battery that slowly whilst uploading "everything" on your phone to Facebook's servers? :-)

Re: Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers are pulling out

#43

Post by TAForObvReasons »

manmal wrote: post #33
amelius wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Less top talent will want to be associated with facebook. I don't necessarily consider myself top-talent, but I'm personally avoiding facebook's open source projects (e.g. React) because I don't approve of their company values.

FB‘s open source projects are one of the few things they are doing right, so why avoid them? AFAIK the licenses are ok, so they are interchangeable in the end as maintainers.

React may have changed to MIT but React-Native and other projects still use the BSD+Patents license.

EDIT: this apparently was fixed last month.

Re: Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers are pulling out

#44

Post by juicy-fruit »

whatshisface wrote: post #29
juicy-fruit wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Less top talent will want to be associated with facebook How certain is this? Whether you like what Facebook does or not, you can't deny their engineering talent is top tier. I don't even use Facebook but I'd still want to work there just to work with the people there and the environment. Companies like Facebook and Google are pretty engineer friendly, more so than other companies. I don't think this event will be t…

If top talent working somewhere was enough to keep top talent from leaving, then no company that employed top talent would ever loose their position without missing payroll.

You have a valid point. Top talent existed in places like Silicon Graphics, Yahoo, etc. I guess you're right, the top probably got off the sinking ship long before the rest of the crew realized what was happening.

However, I still think this event is not "bad" enough for the crew to start fleeing. This is a bump in the road. People may hate Facebook but people sure do love Instagram, WhatsApp and Oculus. Facebook has a pretty strong moat (for now at least).

Re: Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers are pulling out

#45

Post by bitxbit »

jlmorton wrote: post #7

In other words, FB has done somewhat worse than the NASDAQ, and about the same as GOOG over the same time period. Best not to take broad market movements and try to ascribe specific market expectations to individual companies.

Market has been choppy since February but FB moving down will bring other stocks down with it. Google was down over the same period BECAUSE of Facebook. Facebook is very much a bellwether company like it or not.

Re: Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers are pulling out

#46

Post by symlinkk »

stevemk14ebr wrote: post #11

Is it crazy to consider investing in their stocks soon-ish. I totally hate the company but if this is global-minimum i can make some cash pretty easy. I'm relying on the premise that most users will continue to user the site and that this is a short term media frenzy similar to youtube advertiser fiasco.

Not sure why you're being downvoted. Clearly a lot of investors agree with you, as the stock recovered at the end of today to be exactly where it was at the start of the day. If you truly believe what you wrote, then you should invest in it. I disagree with you, but I could be wrong.

Re: Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers are pulling out

#47

Post by user5994461 »

nugi wrote: post #13

This is the beginning of the Big Churn. Less top talent will want to be associated with facebook. Already even a few more privacy clueless friends family members are deleting their accounts. Adverts were always so low yeild, and fb pages 'because we need one'. Now that is all changing due to perception. The FTC, stocks falling, are further indicatuons of falling trust. And all business is built on trust.

Doesn't matter. New users stopped going to Facebook years ago. Teenagers can't be where their parents are.

The hype is Instagram now, which was incidentally bought by Facebook. A brilliant move.

Re: Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers are pulling out

#48

Post by juicy-fruit »

goalieca wrote: post #34
juicy-fruit wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Less top talent will want to be associated with facebook How certain is this? Whether you like what Facebook does or not, you can't deny their engineering talent is top tier. I don't even use Facebook but I'd still want to work there just to work with the people there and the environment. Companies like Facebook and Google are pretty engineer friendly, more so than other companies. I don't think this event will be t…

If facebook’s engineering talent is top tier, then how come I have to recommend to everyone to delete that awful battery draining app.

What kind of counter point is that?

If Apple has top tier talent, why do they ship an OS with a huge security vulnerability? With a map framework that has memory leaks? With a messaging app that messes up the order of messages?

If Google has top tier talent, why did they create an OS that allowed a third party developer to siphon calls, contacts and messages?

If this is your argument, then no company has top talent.

Re: Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers are pulling out

#49

Post by amelius »

manmal wrote: post #33
amelius wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Less top talent will want to be associated with facebook. I don't necessarily consider myself top-talent, but I'm personally avoiding facebook's open source projects (e.g. React) because I don't approve of their company values.

FB‘s open source projects are one of the few things they are doing right, so why avoid them? AFAIK the licenses are ok, so they are interchangeable in the end as maintainers.

It's not the quality of the code I'm concerned about. It's more a matter of principle, and the fact that every use of their software possibly contributes to their reputation and appeal to highly qualified developers.

Re: Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers are pulling out

#50

Post by daveFNbuck »

juicy-fruit wrote: post #25
nugi wrote: post #13

This is the beginning of the Big Churn. Less top talent will want to be associated with facebook. Already even a few more privacy clueless friends family members are deleting their accounts. Adverts were always so low yeild, and fb pages 'because we need one'. Now that is all changing due to perception. The FTC, stocks falling, are further indicatuons of falling trust. And all business is built on trust.

>Less top talent will want to be associated with facebook How certain is this? Whether you like what Facebook does or not, you can't deny their engineering talent is top tier. I don't even use Facebook but I'd still want to work there just to work with the people there and the environment. Companies like Facebook and Google are pretty engineer friendly, more so than other companies. I don't think this event will be t…

I was recently considering responding to the Facebook recruiter that keeps e-mailing me. Now I'm back to a definite no. These things start with people who are more on the fence.
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