How does ‘class-passing’ actually work? • Hacker News Board

Re: How does ‘class-passing’ actually work?

#41

Post by nugget » Thu, Feb 01, 2018, 6:22 PM UTC

ggg9990 wrote: post #19

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It really is true that there are unspoken codes and mores to follow, and it was uncomfortable when I didn't Any examples spring to mind?

Spending $10,000 on a flatscreen TV: low class. Spending $10,000 on a pair of speakers: high class.

I thought about this comment for awhile because I have unassailably high class friends who have spent $10k+ on TVs and sneakers. I think the key is they just do it with confidence. I jokingly made fun of my friend's sneaker collection but he just laughed it off without any hint of concern. Once you understand all the different social queues then you can start to act however you want as long as you have bulletproof self confidence. Taken to extreme lengths you might end up being referred to as eccentric but these days it's almost a desirable label.

Re: How does ‘class-passing’ actually work?

#42

Post by weisser » Thu, Feb 01, 2018, 6:23 PM UTC

hsitz wrote: post #29

staunch wrote: post #3

> In the UK, class consciousness is woven into the national identity. In America, however, people often like to pretend that a class system doesn’t really exist. But, of course, it does. This is the most insidious part. The media in the US has historically been 100% controlled by rich people, and all major media still is. The evil rich people figured out that if you start a gender and race war among the 99%, you can…

This reminds me of an entry from The Book of Life, on "Countries for Losers, and Countries for Winners": http://www.thebookoflife.org/countries-for-losers-countries-... I live in the U.S., but I think I'd prefer to live in one of the countries for losers.

This is fantastic. For those unfamiliar, The Book of Life is an excellent online publication created with the assistance of Alain de Botton who wrote one of my favorite books, “The Course of Love”

Re: How does ‘class-passing’ actually work?

#43

Post by vostok » Thu, Feb 01, 2018, 6:23 PM UTC

jnordwick wrote: post #23

ggg9990 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spending $10,000 on a flatscreen TV: low class. Spending $10,000 on a pair of speakers: high class.

Totally backwards. You'll find more expensive shoes in Harlem than Astoria.

It's unlcear to me which of the two is considered "higher class".

I think Astoria is slightly wealthier than Harlem in recent history, but neither is known for for having a particularly moneyed population.

Today, I know more wealthy people in Harlem than in Astoria.

Re: How does ‘class-passing’ actually work?

#44

Post by emodendroket » Thu, Feb 01, 2018, 6:24 PM UTC

whytheam wrote: post #25

The number one indicator of your class standing is your parents' class standing. There is no American Dream, and "Rags to Riches" is more luck than skill and effort.

You think you're rebutting the article, but it says those exact things.

Re: How does ‘class-passing’ actually work?

#45

Post by saget » Thu, Feb 01, 2018, 6:25 PM UTC

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #11

gorpomon wrote: post #7

I spent a summer in NYC a few years ago. While living in NYC I did get a flavor of higher class living with some roommates of mine. It really is true that there are unspoken codes and mores to follow, and it was uncomfortable when I didn't. However, this is one issue that's hard to put solely on the foot of the rich or a broader system. Passing in many avenues, not just by class, is really deciding you want to be the…

> It really is true that there are unspoken codes and mores to follow, and it was uncomfortable when I didn't Any examples spring to mind?

How you dress is very important. Knowing enough about current events and having your own, thoughtful opinion about them. Knowing a number of books and using them in conversation. Rules on when to be blunt are different. Never order a burger at a restaurant. I could go on but it's a hard thing to summarize. (source: was middle/lower class, now have many 1% friends)

Re: How does ‘class-passing’ actually work?

#46

Post by mancerayder » Thu, Feb 01, 2018, 6:26 PM UTC

staunch wrote: post #3

> In the UK, class consciousness is woven into the national identity. In America, however, people often like to pretend that a class system doesn’t really exist. But, of course, it does. This is the most insidious part. The media in the US has historically been 100% controlled by rich people, and all major media still is. The evil rich people figured out that if you start a gender and race war among the 99%, you can…

The internet will almost certainly spawn a social movement to destroy the class system in the US. People are just waking up to how bad it is. The #MeToo movement only happened because rich people are losing media control, and it's just one of many to come.

I don't buy it. First of all, the class system is about material interests - real physical tangible interests - and not about feelings. Even if 99% of the people live in a world of ideas, the ruling class, by virtue of the fact that they have to bargain over laws (multi hundred page documents that decide taxation and allocation as well as employee and business rights), live in the world of the material.

The American populace lives, and probably since at least the mid 20th century has lived, in a world of ideas. By this I mean, the country is torn asunder by feelings about abortion, race, gender and so forth, immigration [edit: and also celebrity-lead culture] -- all issues that, guess what, don't even touch the interests of the .01%.

#MeToo poses no threat whatsoever to any class system.

Re: How does ‘class-passing’ actually work?

#47

Post by killjoywashere » Thu, Feb 01, 2018, 6:26 PM UTC

ggg9990 wrote: post #26

lisper wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The internet will almost certainly spawn a social movement to destroy the class system in the US. Right. I'm sure that the fact that the leading internet companies are run by Harvard (FB) and Stanford (Google) grads will not interfere with the Revolution in any way.

It’s more that the Internet can enable the kind of coordination that a mass movement to revoke power needs.

Oil could have enabled that kind of coordiation too, how'd that work out? For a mass movement, you need lots of leaders (of people) to band together and agree to steer the ship in a specific direction.

Re: How does ‘class-passing’ actually work?

#48

Post by afuchs » Thu, Feb 01, 2018, 6:27 PM UTC

staunch wrote: post #3

> In the UK, class consciousness is woven into the national identity. In America, however, people often like to pretend that a class system doesn’t really exist. But, of course, it does. This is the most insidious part. The media in the US has historically been 100% controlled by rich people, and all major media still is. The evil rich people figured out that if you start a gender and race war among the 99%, you can…

> ... > The evil rich people figured out that if you start a gender and race war among the 99%, you can distract them from the fact that they're all being economically exploited and subjected to wage slavery. > ...

Stated this way, this appears to handwave real problems away. Yes, racial and gender issues are often exploited for political gain; but these issues usually have a basis in real problems.

Re: How does ‘class-passing’ actually work?

#49

Post by emodendroket » Thu, Feb 01, 2018, 6:27 PM UTC

dsacco wrote: post #38

The first step to understanding the class system is to differentiate between class and wealth. Class has very little to do with wealth, and it is mostly determined by your upbringing, mannerisms, profession, lifestyle and network. A high net worth is helpful but insufficient for gaining entry to the higher class. It can also work against you, if you’re too visible with your money and spend it frivolously. For example…

The article actually profiles one guy who had to acclimate himself twice over, first to the old-money world of the East Coast, then once more over to the new-money world of Silicon Valley.

Re: How does ‘class-passing’ actually work?

#50

Post by gf263 » Thu, Feb 01, 2018, 6:29 PM UTC

saget wrote: post #45

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It really is true that there are unspoken codes and mores to follow, and it was uncomfortable when I didn't Any examples spring to mind?

How you dress is very important. Knowing enough about current events and having your own, thoughtful opinion about them. Knowing a number of books and using them in conversation. Rules on when to be blunt are different. Never order a burger at a restaurant. I could go on but it's a hard thing to summarize. (source: was middle/lower class, now have many 1% friends)

>never order a burger at a restaurant

Whelp there goes my dreams of hanging with rich people