Live data from Hacker News

Google translates German “halb zwei” to French “deux heures et demie”: 1h off

translate.google.com

41–50 of 94 posts

Re: Google translates German “halb zwei” to French “deux heures et demie”: 1h off

#41
post #14
post #9

To help my fellow English-speakers: "halb zwei" ("half two") is the German idiom for "halfway [between one and] two o'clock" "deux heures et demie" ("two hours and one half") is a much better cognate for the English "half past two o'clock" We're all used to off-by-one and fencepost errors. To be honest, this is probably a less interesting one of Google translate's mistranslations. But it's one that's very mechanical…

To make things even more confusing, “half two” means 2:30 in the UK and Ireland.

And this is very likely the reason for the mistake. See, Google Translate seems to take a shortcut to translating between language A and B, by translating from A to English and English to B.

For instance, for the last five years or so I've been seeing GT translate the Greek word for "swallow", the bird, to the French word for "to swallow", the verb [1]. In Greek and French, the two words have nothing in common (Greek is helidoni/katapino, French is hirondele/avaler). But in English, they are homonyms (swallow/swallow). It seems that GT sees a Greek word, translates it in English, then finds a set of homonyms and simply chooses the translation that's most "likely", meaning the one that's used to most often- which of course means it gets one meaning wrong all the time.

Last year Google made a big todo about its neural nets inventing an "interlingua", an intermediary language to which and from which all other languages it knows can be translated. In practice, I think this "interlingua" ends up being just plain old English.

_________________

[1] Recently I started seeing the translation "machaon", a kind of butterfly, which Google translates in English as "swallowtail". "Avaler" is still available as an alternative.

Re: Google translates German “halb zwei” to French “deux heures et demie”: 1h off

#44
post #26

i hate this kind of time communicating in austria there is "viertel zwei" - quarter two which in one part of austria (vienna) means 1:15pm (or 1:15am), in the other half (90% of austria) it is understood as 1:45pm (or 1:45am), sometimes as 2:15pm (or 2:15am) - but never as 1:15pm/am "viertel [vor/nach] zwei" - quarter [to/after] two. the [] are optional.

When I first moved to Stuttgart I was confused by the Swabian "viertel" (quarter) and "dreiviertel" (three quarters). The first means quarter after and the second quarter before the hour.

Re: Google translates German “halb zwei” to French “deux heures et demie”: 1h off

#45
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike the German and French versions, that doesn't make any sense at all.

It's a colloquial contraction of "half past 2". To me, the German makes no sense - half of 2 is 1. Agreed though that the French is the most easily understood internationally.

And one problem is that no-one on the European continent learns that at school or hears that on TV. I got quite confused when I recently started to travel to the UK and Ireland a bit more often.

Re: Google translates German “halb zwei” to French “deux heures et demie”: 1h off

#47
post #17
post #10

Um halb drei -> À trois heures et demie Um halb drei gehen -> Aller à deux heures et demie Um halb drei gehen wir -> A quatre heures et demie nous partons Um halb drei gehen wir ins Kino. -> A trois heures et demie nous allons au cinéma.

For DeepL: -> À trois heures et demie -> 14 h 30 du soir, -> À 14 h 30, -> On va au cinéma à 14h30. Correct for everything but the first, not sure why it added "du soir". For the a complete sentence "Um halb drei gehen wir." it's also correct ("On part à 14h30.").

As far as I can tell it's _in_correct in every instance except the first:

  À trois heures et demie = À trois heures et demie

  Aller à deux heures et demie =\= 14 h 30 du soir [1]

  A quatre heures et demie nous partons =\= À 14 h 30 [2]
 
  A trois heures et demie nous allons au cinéma. =\= On va au cinéma à 14h30 [3]
[1] misses the "to go" part and also gets the time of day wrong- which is important because it uses 24-hour clock notation (and so it's obvious that it has no idea what 14h30 means).

[2] completely misses the action ("nous partons") and gets the time wrong ("quatre heures" is "four o'clock", not 14).

[3] Still gets the hour wrong (14h30 to "trois heures", i.e. three).

You'd certainly wouldn't want those translations to "help" you with your appointments in France, or Germany.

Re: Google translates German “halb zwei” to French “deux heures et demie”: 1h off

#48

I wonder if this is just due to a lot of translated documents getting it wrong. And thus having mis-trained the ai.

My go-to bad machine-learning translation is from Swedish "Män som hatar kvinnor" to "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo". The correct translation is "Men who hate women" the book's original title. We can deduce why it picked up the wrong translation in that case, harder to say here.

Re: Google translates German “halb zwei” to French “deux heures et demie”: 1h off

#49
post #26

i hate this kind of time communicating in austria there is "viertel zwei" - quarter two which in one part of austria (vienna) means 1:15pm (or 1:15am), in the other half (90% of austria) it is understood as 1:45pm (or 1:45am), sometimes as 2:15pm (or 2:15am) - but never as 1:15pm/am "viertel [vor/nach] zwei" - quarter [to/after] two. the [] are optional.

Wait, why does "viertel zwei" mean 1:15? What's "viertel eins"?

Viertel zwei = a quarter of the second hour has passed, i.e., it's 1:15. It's a logical extension of the standard-language "halb zwei". But note that this is only used and understood in some German-speaking regions, not all!
Post reply on HN