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How super are those pricey 'superfoods'?

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Re: How super are those pricey 'superfoods'?

#41
post #16
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Coconut water was always very popular as soft drink in producing countries. Not waste.

Common, but in somewhat limited quantities. "Anecdotal sources describe coconut water is used in India for the senicide of elderly people, a procedure known as thalaikoothal.[13] In this custom, the elderly person is made to drink an excessive amount of coconut water, eventually resulting in fever and death, the exact causes of which have not been determined.[13]"

I'm not sure what your point is here.

It's well-known that green coconut vendors are very common in India (https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Tender_coconut_vendo...). They have a cart of coconuts, chop the top off of one as you watch, and hand it to you to drink. As a tourist, it seemed to me to be safer than drinking water.

So, to the original point above, coconut water is not waste, and is quite refreshing, and fills a useful niche if you're worried about stomach bugs.

Re: How super are those pricey 'superfoods'?

#42
post #39
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the benefit of containing neurotransmitters? I hit up Wikipedia and see they carry signals. I'm not seeing how that is a benefit, however. They appear to carry any signal, not some special signals. Unless one has too few (I'm not sure what might even cause that) then I'm not seeing why that's beneficial.

I don't think they can cross the blood brain barrier, but I think I've read that some can get partially metabolized into a precursor, travel across the BBB, and then re-assembled within the brain. Probably not particularly necessary for healthy individuals, but could reduce the amount of work needed to synthesize your own transmitters (few steps rather than 'from scratch'). Perhaps some individuals with neurotransmit…

Hmm... If I'm understanding correctly, they might possible be bound to opiate molecules and increase efficacy in hitting the receptors?

That makes some sense. By itself, I can't think of how it would benefit a healthy person. I'm not even sure what kinds of unhealthy people that might help.

So, to me it looked like, 'Hey, here are some fancy words! Don't look too deep, because they are mostly meaningless.' No offense intended, that's just what it looked like to a curious layman.

I have a commercial wild blueberry operation so I hear some really, really strange claims. Things like this peg my skepticism meter. No, my blueberries won't turn you into Superman or Einstein. They don't cure cancer, prevent HIV, or give you psychic powers.

Re: How super are those pricey 'superfoods'?

#43
post #41
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Common, but in somewhat limited quantities. "Anecdotal sources describe coconut water is used in India for the senicide of elderly people, a procedure known as thalaikoothal.[13] In this custom, the elderly person is made to drink an excessive amount of coconut water, eventually resulting in fever and death, the exact causes of which have not been determined.[13]"

I'm not sure what your point is here. It's well-known that green coconut vendors are very common in India ( https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Tender_coconut_vendo... ). They have a cart of coconuts, chop the top off of one as you watch, and hand it to you to drink. As a tourist, it seemed to me to be safer than drinking water. So, to the original point above, coconut water is not waste, and is quite refreshing,…

I agree it's a common drink, but much like orange juice it's not good in large quantities. So, the reason it ended up as a waste product was supply vastly outstripped demand.

Re: How super are those pricey 'superfoods'?

#45
post #42
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think they can cross the blood brain barrier, but I think I've read that some can get partially metabolized into a precursor, travel across the BBB, and then re-assembled within the brain. Probably not particularly necessary for healthy individuals, but could reduce the amount of work needed to synthesize your own transmitters (few steps rather than 'from scratch'). Perhaps some individuals with neurotransmit…

Hmm... If I'm understanding correctly, they might possible be bound to opiate molecules and increase efficacy in hitting the receptors? That makes some sense. By itself, I can't think of how it would benefit a healthy person. I'm not even sure what kinds of unhealthy people that might help. So, to me it looked like, 'Hey, here are some fancy words! Don't look too deep, because they are mostly meaningless.' No offense…

I don't think nettles have opiate-like molecules. (Would probably be counter productive - less pain, poorer defense mechanism)

Nettles have serotonin, histamine, and acetylcholine. Serotonin could benefit certain mood disorders, and acetylcholine supplementation can reduce certain kinds of headaches.

As with all natural foods/medicines, I think you'd typically see only minor benefits over long-term supplementation. Much less powerful than modern medicine, but perhaps fewer side effects when taken properly.

You're right to be skeptical though, lots of snake-oil salesmen in the natural food space making dubious claims. Blueberries are probably much healthier for you than eating Cheetos, but probably not that different from other berries. I appreciate scientists studying which species have the most nutrition, but variance in freshness and growing conditions are probably the biggest factors in nutritional density. ex. fresh raspberry are probably better than old poorly grown blueberries.

Re: How super are those pricey 'superfoods'?

#46
post #25
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd like to see some evidence of that. No sarcasm, I'd be interested if someone could provide some. But the article kindly provided evidence that coconut water does not hydrate better, and I found it particularly interesting that it hydrated exactly as well, which to me strongly suggests that the primary driver in how hydrating something is, unsurprisingly, the water in it. I find the science part of my mind is not a…

Pseudo source - https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/lifeandst... Money quote : “study in the Journal of Applied Physiology found that consuming an isotonic sports drink increased treadmill running time to exhaustion by 27% in recreational runners.” It doesn’t say what journal though. The key also seems to be isotonic drinks according to that article.

That's not hydration

Re: How super are those pricey 'superfoods'?

#47
post #45
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm... If I'm understanding correctly, they might possible be bound to opiate molecules and increase efficacy in hitting the receptors? That makes some sense. By itself, I can't think of how it would benefit a healthy person. I'm not even sure what kinds of unhealthy people that might help. So, to me it looked like, 'Hey, here are some fancy words! Don't look too deep, because they are mostly meaningless.' No offense…

I don't think nettles have opiate-like molecules. (Would probably be counter productive - less pain, poorer defense mechanism) Nettles have serotonin, histamine, and acetylcholine. Serotonin could benefit certain mood disorders, and acetylcholine supplementation can reduce certain kinds of headaches. As with all natural foods/medicines, I think you'd typically see only minor benefits over long-term supplementation. M…

I meant they could be chemically bound with opiate molecules in a separate process. Not that they contained them by default and in nature. Sorry for the confusion.

Blueberries contain antioxidants! LOL

Re: How super are those pricey 'superfoods'?

#48
post #23

They seem to be making strangely isolated measurements that have little to do with the claimed benefits of the alleged superfoods. For starters I think most people agree there is no need to replace electrolytes during endurance activities that do not exceed 1 hour, oddly the length of time in this study. I’m not sure anyone claims coconut water hydrates better than water, but certainly it’s going to be more beneficia…

Once you start getting into this type of thinking it's really easy to go down a rabbit hole. I'd love to see the same research, but if you start digging into this subject you will be disappointed in the answers you get. After researching this stuff as a hobby for some time, I've come to the conclusion that this stuff is not well understood and there is still a lot left to explore. As technical people, we sometimes lo…

Personally I think the data, if not the studies are readily available, it’s just impossible to have a conversation about diet and nutrition. For example, look at this thread and you would think all you need to do is have 1 person run a treadmill for 1 hour drinking tap water and day 2 repeat the run with coconut water and boom...a legitimate study that “superfoods” are a myth.

Continue in this thread and you will note comments, for no reason whatsoever, emphatically stating antioxidants don’t exist. But just to preemptively dissuade a dialogue a suggestion people who believe antioxidants exist also believe their consumption will prevent all cancer...somehow no middle ground exists. Such is my experience discussing diet.

I find it’s not just with healthy foods and diets, but one can’t even discuss the correlation of diet and obesity, chronic inflammation, cardio vascular disease, heart disease or diabetes...at least without someone linking to a McDonald’s, Twinkie or ice cream diet where the subject lost weight. In fact I recently had a professor argue with me here on HN that the development of fatty liver disease and type 2 diabetes in children (formerly adult onset diabetes) was unrelated to sugar but rather some mystery variable which hadn’t been discovered because children hadn’t been diagnosed with type 2 diabetes prior to the 1980’s and he ate a ton of sugar growing up in the 70’s.

History and entire populace’s of people can serve as the data. Look at the historical diet in Okinawa where they once had the longest life expectancy (but not since the introduction of western diet post WW2) and you will find nutrient/vitamin dense but low calorie foods, foods that are anti-inflammatory, anti-oxidant rich, promote healthy liver and kidney function (detoxification). The concepts are not dissimilar to the Mediterranean diet, which also promotes health and longevity, while the foods themselves are dissimilar. It should come as no surprise that these are the same conclusions you and darktree seem to come to with your own experience, only you are focusing more on the macro side of things. I think what you are finding is you are healthy when you maximizie vitamin/nutrient to calorie intake, remove/minimize refined sugar and carbs (both inflammatory and insulin production triggers). Within that framework you can have foods (diets) as diverse as historical Okinawa and the Mediterranean diet, it just so happens food labeled superfoods also tend to (but not always) fall within the same framework.

Re: How super are those pricey 'superfoods'?

#49
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both energy drinks and milk absorb better than water. Doesn't seem odd that coconut water is in the and category.

Doesn't matter. Even if I only absorbed 90% of the water I drank, I could just drink 1.111 L of water to get 1 L of "hydration", and it would still be cheaper than drinking 1 L of Brawndo, the Thirst Annihilator. On a money cost basis, in any place on Earth that has municipal drinking water on tap, drinking that water is the cheapest way to hydrate your body. Whether or not "best" includes the money cost is a matter…

But Brawndo's got electrolytes.

Re: How super are those pricey 'superfoods'?

#50
post #30
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"antioxidants" is also on my bullshit list

What? Sure, don't buy the marketing hype but antioxidants ingested via food (as oppposed to pills) is supposed to be beneficial to you. When you say it's "on your bullshit list" do you mean you don't believe in things like free radicals? Or do you mean that you don't think there's antioxidants in abundant supply in said product?

Even if antioxidants are good for you, I can't see a cup of juice being the optimal way to get them. 160 calories / 8 oz serving.

As far as antioxidants themselves are concerned, if you do go the pills route, be sure it's not too much. High levels are linked to increased cancer risk, which is the opposite of what people are going for. How much is too much? I dunno, but I figure the amount I get from drinking tea isn't going to kill me.

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