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Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

wsj.com

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Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#41

Post by Synaesthesia »

iloveluce wrote: post #6

I hope NSA is doing the same with Russian Cyber Defense systems. This is what NSA should be focused on and not on turning its eavesdropping capabilities towards the homeland. What if an adversary where to hack the NSA warehouses were all communications swept up by their eavesdropping efforts are stored?

Of course they are. They have teams of hackers and security experts working on offensive and defensive cyberwarfare.

Re: Spying on the homeland, governments generally regard the domestic population as a threat and and enemy.

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#42

Post by pdx »

beepboopbeep wrote: post #27
igivanov wrote: post #24

No confirmation from the NSA, only "leaks" from anonymous "multiple people with knowledge of the matter." How do we know it's not another piece of fake news riding the wave of "Russia did it"?

Welp! Ya solved it! Good job! We can all go home now everyone. This guy solved it. Rest assured, that this story was not thoroughly researched and is indeed fake news. Go on now, nothing to see here.

I agree with you. There is nothing to see here.

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#43

Post by tlrobinson »

strictnein wrote: post #36
tlrobinson wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe keda's point is it's served over HTTP not HTTPS so there's no way to verify you're not being MITM'd when looking at it. (A possible workaround is to check via multiple connections, check Google's cache, etc)

I mean, sure, but if you're sending him a PGP encrypted message, and his public key was messed with, the end result would just be his inability to open the message. I think his actual point was to try and discredit the messenger.

The attacker would then be able to read your encrypted messsage (and possibly re-encrypt it with the original key before forwarding it)

Also, PGP keys may also be used to sign software or other public messages (not a typical use-case for journalists, though)

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#44

Post by Synaesthesia »

igivanov wrote: post #24

No confirmation from the NSA, only "leaks" from anonymous "multiple people with knowledge of the matter." How do we know it's not another piece of fake news riding the wave of "Russia did it"?

I agree that there is a lot of Russia blaming and such but this article is pretty credible. Only of course US newspapers aren’t gonna be writing about the hacks that they succeed in.

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#45

Post by strictnein »

woliveirajr wrote: post #38
strictnein wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uhmm... that's a public key. So it doesn't matter. He could put it on a billboard in Times Square.

It does matter. Someone could replace his public key with a fake one. Everything that would be encrypted so that only he could see it could end up in wrong hands, because somebody would trust "I'm encrypting using his public key, I can tell anything to that guy", and the bad guy would read it.

I'm confused how you think transferring the PGP key through secure means would prevent that. It only (mostly) ensures the message you receive is valid.

They could far more easily gain access to his server through a variety of means and upload a different copy of his key than try and do a MITM or whatever. It's not like he's going to notice if the key changes.

What you're proposing is that an intelligence service is going to MITM you and gain access to the journalist's computer or email server to read the messages you may send him? Why? The messages are unencrypted when read on his system and when typed on yours, so there are far easier ways to get at their contents.

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#46

Post by strictnein »

tlrobinson wrote: post #43
strictnein wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, sure, but if you're sending him a PGP encrypted message, and his public key was messed with, the end result would just be his inability to open the message. I think his actual point was to try and discredit the messenger.

The attacker would then be able to read your encrypted messsage (and possibly re-encrypt it with the original key before forwarding it) Also, PGP keys may also be used to sign software or other public messages (not a typical use-case for journalists, though)

You're kind of out in the weeds now.

Also, you don't sign software or whatever with a public key, so I'm not 100% sure you understand how this works.

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#47

Post by benmowa »

tlrobinson wrote: post #39
runesoerensen wrote: post #10

Kaspersky preempting (presumably) this story: "New conspiracy theory, anon sources media story coming. Note we make no apologies for being aggressive in the battle against cyberthreats" https://twitter.com/e_kaspersky/status/915946040561487875 Edit: Kaspersky press release https://usa.kaspersky.com/about/press-releases/2017_kaspersk...

Heh, an extreme interpretation of that statement could be that Kaspersky considers the NSA to be a "cyberthreat"...

well.... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clipper_chip

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#48

Post by joe_the_user »

jakelarkin wrote: post #34

how Kaspersky was ever thought to be "okay" in the US enterprise/government market has always been perplexing to me. Antivirus, something which literally inspects all of your files and network activity, made in the country that's a hotbed of blackhat activity and home one of the most aggressive cyber-espionage militaries outside the US. yea okay great, sign me up.

Well, at this point, which anti-virus product you use is gradually devolving to "which state do you want to spy on you?". And the problem is, the answer may not be "the state I live in", since that state is the most likely to tax and otherwise regulate you.

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#49

Post by thephyber »

tlrobinson wrote: post #39
runesoerensen wrote: post #10

Kaspersky preempting (presumably) this story: "New conspiracy theory, anon sources media story coming. Note we make no apologies for being aggressive in the battle against cyberthreats" https://twitter.com/e_kaspersky/status/915946040561487875 Edit: Kaspersky press release https://usa.kaspersky.com/about/press-releases/2017_kaspersk...

Heh, an extreme interpretation of that statement could be that Kaspersky considers the NSA to be a "cyberthreat"...

Jacob Applebaum publicly claimed (at the Chaos Computer Club, Germany, in the mid-2010s) that the Five Eyes and other intelligence services, for better or worse, attack employees of network providers, SaaS providers, and likely native software providers.

It's not clear to me if it matters what country they are working from. If the NSA has a credible threat in the USA, they can be authorized to assist with domestic intelligence services to infiltrate services required to get their job done.

One specific attack he claimed happened was a MITM of LinkedIn connections at foreign ISPs. I don't think it's a stretch to call them a "cyberthreat", especially if you are a Russian citizen or are trying to secure computer systems outside of the USA (I'm giving Kaspersky a generous benefit of the doubt).

Re: Russian Hackers Stole NSA Data on U.S. Cyber Defense

#50

Post by lallysingh »

joe_the_user wrote: post #48
jakelarkin wrote: post #34

how Kaspersky was ever thought to be "okay" in the US enterprise/government market has always been perplexing to me. Antivirus, something which literally inspects all of your files and network activity, made in the country that's a hotbed of blackhat activity and home one of the most aggressive cyber-espionage militaries outside the US. yea okay great, sign me up.

Well, at this point, which anti-virus product you use is gradually devolving to "which state do you want to spy on you?". And the problem is, the answer may not be "the state I live in", since that state is the most likely to tax and otherwise regulate you.

https://www.clamav.net/ ?
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