All this technology is amazing, but does it have any applications beyond mechanical timepieces?
Do analog watches have any applications to begin with, these days?
EMP resistance. This isn't exactly a practical justification for most uses, of course.
New oscillator system in Zenith mechanical watches
41–50 of 67 posts
Re: New oscillator system in Zenith mechanical watches
#42Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is silicon-material manufacturing now within reach of industries other than IC manufacturers and high-end watch manufacturers? If so, you could imagine all sorts of mechanical devices that will experience a renaissance now that they can be precisely designed and manufactured in tiny sizes and in huge numbers. I suspect I just reinvented nanotechnology. For some reason, this watch article makes it feel much more real.
Have you heard of MEMS before? There seems lots of cool applications for that, apparently also Timex is bringing out a watch which uses the technology in some way ( http://www.ablogtowatch.com/timex-silmach-watch-movements-me... ). Also MEMS is used in DLP projectors, where lots of tiny little mirrors can be moved which seems rather amazing.
Ah, of course. Thanks. Yet another set of dots I hadn't connected.
From the Wikipedia article, one might even say this is a MEMS watch. MEMS describes devices up to 1mm having components up to 100 microns. This watch has parts as thin as 20 microns, so although it is overall larger than MEMS, its components encroach on MEMS territory.
Re: New oscillator system in Zenith mechanical watches
#43Earlier quoted context omitted.
Fair point. Spring drive is a very fascinating concept and one could debate for weeks on end in the right (or, rather, wrong) circles whether it or co-ax holds the top spot. (Or whether the spring drive is even a fully mechanical movement or a hybrid!) (And I should have been more precise - I meant in mechanical horology; my apologies) Not that there's anything wrong with quartz (except its inherent inaccuracies; I s…
How can we debate whether the spring drive's fully mechanical or not? It's got a quartz oscillator and an integrated circuit.
Well, for one, the escapement doesn't depend on the quartz crystal for timekeeping, but on magnetic induction.
Spring drive would theoretically work without the quartz components. Seeing how they would generate an electrical current because of the principle, they build a tiny generator to drive a circuit that adjusts the escapement, but doesn't run it.
Also, Spring Drive depends on a fully mechanical wheel train and barrel spring to function; it could not be made to work with a battery.
So what exactly constitutes mechanical and what does quartz here? Is it the wheel train? Does electro-mechanical count as mechanical? Is the mere presence of a quartz crystal in a secondary circuit enough to call it a quartz?
I found it easier to see it a as a new different system for timekeeping instead of trying to place it on an arbitrary scale between "fully mechanical" and "quartz."
Re: New oscillator system in Zenith mechanical watches
#44Earlier quoted context omitted.
> the probably largest innovation horology over the past couple of hundred years There was this little thing called the quartz revolution though :) Just because it turned out you can make really cheap watches with it doesn't make it less of an innovation. But limiting the field down to mechanical watches, there is also Seiko's springdrive which manages to combine the durability of mechanical watches whilst approachin…
Fair point. Spring drive is a very fascinating concept and one could debate for weeks on end in the right (or, rather, wrong) circles whether it or co-ax holds the top spot. (Or whether the spring drive is even a fully mechanical movement or a hybrid!) (And I should have been more precise - I meant in mechanical horology; my apologies) Not that there's anything wrong with quartz (except its inherent inaccuracies; I s…
> one could debate for weeks on end
That is certainly and certifiably true :)
Although I'm very fond of Springdrive (and Seiko in general), it's just an example that I thought would be more recognisable than, say PP's use of ceramic components. I wouldn't want to claim any of these advancements as more significant innovations than Co-Ax escapements in what is increasingly an art-for-the-sake-of-art (or tech-because-we-can) endeavour anyway.
It's best just to marvel and to start thinking of how to explain the expense to the significant other.
Re: New oscillator system in Zenith mechanical watches
#45Earlier quoted context omitted.
How can we debate whether the spring drive's fully mechanical or not? It's got a quartz oscillator and an integrated circuit.
Well, for one, the escapement doesn't depend on the quartz crystal for timekeeping, but on magnetic induction. Spring drive would theoretically work without the quartz components. Seeing how they would generate an electrical current because of the principle, they build a tiny generator to drive a circuit that adjusts the escapement, but doesn't run it. Also, Spring Drive depends on a fully mechanical wheel train and…
How does the spring drive actually work? What is the mechanism which keeps it moving at a consistent speed? A quick google only turned up rather vague descriptions.
Re: New oscillator system in Zenith mechanical watches
#46I am a long-time watch nut, and I loved this write-up - it concisely explained what makes this mechanism unique and was most educational. Fun to see a departure from the norm - until this, the probably largest innovation horology over the past couple of hundred years was George Daniels' coaxial escapement (which basically eliminated friction from the equation, ensuring all transfer of energy in the escapement took pl…
There's one basic question I couldn't figure out from the article. Where is the spring that you wind up and that stores the "power reserve of about 60 hours"? Is it part of the silicon? Or is it external? I figured out that the three crescent-shaped parts are springy ("flex laterally to provide a restoring force as the oscillator vibrates through six degrees of amplitude"), but it doesn't look like there's anything e…
The energy is stored in a big spiral spring, the mainspring, as in a conventional mechanical watch. The oscillator does away with another spring, the balance spring.
Re: New oscillator system in Zenith mechanical watches
#47It's likely that this is a paid post. And if that's the case, then I think it's money well-spent, as this is a beautiful post and an effective advertisement.
Only 10 have been made and all have been sold for some exorbant amount, so mostly it’s genuinely motivated coverage of some cool tech.
Zenith is also debuting a new material for the case: a composite called Aeronith. Aeronith is essentially an aluminum foam; melted aluminum is poured into a mold "where a procedure initially developed by Hublot transforms it into an open pore metal foam," according to Zenith. The voids in the foam are then filled with an "extremely light polymer" and the result is 2.7 times lighter than titanium, 1.7 times lighter than solid aluminum, and even 10% lighter than carbon fiber..
F1 engine tech, in a watch case, and that's not even the innovative part. Sooooo cool.
Re: New oscillator system in Zenith mechanical watches
#48Earlier quoted context omitted.
How can we debate whether the spring drive's fully mechanical or not? It's got a quartz oscillator and an integrated circuit.
Well, for one, the escapement doesn't depend on the quartz crystal for timekeeping, but on magnetic induction. Spring drive would theoretically work without the quartz components. Seeing how they would generate an electrical current because of the principle, they build a tiny generator to drive a circuit that adjusts the escapement, but doesn't run it. Also, Spring Drive depends on a fully mechanical wheel train and…
> Well, for one, the escapement doesn't depend on the quartz crystal for timekeeping
No, it uses the quartz crystal for timekeeping. It keeps time like any other digital watch, only it outputs that time by controlling the rotor's speed, and gets its power from the rotor.
It could keep time mechanically instead and still use electronics to maintain the rotor's speed. But in fact it uses a quartz crystal.
Re: New oscillator system in Zenith mechanical watches
#49Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, for one, the escapement doesn't depend on the quartz crystal for timekeeping, but on magnetic induction. Spring drive would theoretically work without the quartz components. Seeing how they would generate an electrical current because of the principle, they build a tiny generator to drive a circuit that adjusts the escapement, but doesn't run it. Also, Spring Drive depends on a fully mechanical wheel train and…
How does the spring drive actually work? What is the mechanism which keeps it moving at a consistent speed? A quick google only turned up rather vague descriptions.
At the heart of every mechanical watch lies a coiled spring. Within that spring energy is stored that wants to be released.
This energy is released through the wheel train, which is a set of cogs with reductions (some of them attached to the hands).
Left to its own device this system would just spin as quickly as possible until the spring is unwound.
To prevent this, somewhere in the train there is something called a lever escapement. Simple put, this puts a stick in a cog at regular intervals to prevent it from spinning and unwinding freely. This stick is timed by a weight that spins from left to right. This stick literally is what makes watches tick, since that's where the ticking sound comes from.
Spring Drive doesn't poke a stick into a wheel to prevent the system from freely unwinding. What it does do is add magnets to the wheel and stationary coils around it. The wheel can't spin freely since it has to overcome the magnetic induction as the magnets pass the coils. That's the reason SpringDrive doesn't tick and the hands glide instead of stopping and starting.
If it's still unclear, try looking up escapement levers first. There should be a lot of clear animated explanations online.
Re: New oscillator system in Zenith mechanical watches
#50I am a long-time watch nut, and I loved this write-up - it concisely explained what makes this mechanism unique and was most educational. Fun to see a departure from the norm - until this, the probably largest innovation horology over the past couple of hundred years was George Daniels' coaxial escapement (which basically eliminated friction from the equation, ensuring all transfer of energy in the escapement took pl…
There's one basic question I couldn't figure out from the article. Where is the spring that you wind up and that stores the "power reserve of about 60 hours"? Is it part of the silicon? Or is it external? I figured out that the three crescent-shaped parts are springy ("flex laterally to provide a restoring force as the oscillator vibrates through six degrees of amplitude"), but it doesn't look like there's anything e…
This video may help, as you get to see the movement in action: https://youtu.be/xWh0p9Irznw
It doesn’t clearly show the mainspring, however at around 10:45 you can see the small gear spinning. That is being driven by the mainspring, and if you removed the escapement it would spin super quick until the mainspring was unwound.
It’s the constant rocking back and forth of the regulator that limits the speed that small gear (called the escape wheel) can rotate, therefore limiting how quickly the mainspring releases it’s energy.