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Investor Bulletin, July 25: Initial Coin Offerings

sec.gov

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Re: Investor Bulletin, July 25: Initial Coin Offerings

#41

Post by jerkstate »

thrill wrote: post #33
TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Ethereum .. turned out to actually deliver all the crazy stuff they promised I'm just a bystander in all this but I distinctly remember the phrase the code is law bandied about, followed by a hard fork.

The exception proves the rule here. The only way to override the "code is law" model was to create a new coin, using the fact that a majority of miners voting for a particular new model means that becomes the new model - the creators just used their community weight to keep the old name. They most explicitly were not able to change the values in the old blockchain without the fork.

An interesting side note of that is if the majority of miners voting decided to zap the wallets of all known nazis and white supremacists, they could do that too.

Re: Investor Bulletin, July 25: Initial Coin Offerings

#42

Post by TheSpiceIsLife »

jerkstate wrote: post #41
thrill wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The exception proves the rule here. The only way to override the "code is law" model was to create a new coin, using the fact that a majority of miners voting for a particular new model means that becomes the new model - the creators just used their community weight to keep the old name. They most explicitly were not able to change the values in the old blockchain without the fork.

An interesting side note of that is if the majority of miners voting decided to zap the wallets of all known nazis and white supremacists, they could do that too.

It's interesting to note that existing financial institutions can do this too. And in fact they do, if they suspect you are involved in a variety of criminal activity they can freeze your accounts and alert law enforcement.

However, those institutions are subject to the rule of law, and if you are wrongly treated you can expect restitution.

From my perspective, cryptocurrencies are a sort of wild wild west at the moment where the standard appears to be: if you are wrongly treated good luck!.

Re: Investor Bulletin, July 25: Initial Coin Offerings

#43

Post by lucasverra »

TheAceOfHearts wrote: post #17

I don't have anything to add to this discussion, but I just wanna say that I'm impressed by the bulletin's clarity. I'm used to reading government information that's difficult to parse and dive into. It's easy to fall into a belief that government agencies don't really know what they're doing, and it's just a bunch of monkeys banging at typewriters, but seeing clearly written posts discussing current and relevant eve…

Does anybody know a nice ICO timeline coupled with line charts that would help to grasp the (up to date) bigger picture of this phenomenon ? So far the best i've stumble upon is : https://www.tokendata.io/ but the time dimension is not linear nor clear

Re: Investor Bulletin, July 25: Initial Coin Offerings

#44

Post by ubernostrum »

thrill wrote: post #33
TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Ethereum .. turned out to actually deliver all the crazy stuff they promised I'm just a bystander in all this but I distinctly remember the phrase the code is law bandied about, followed by a hard fork.

The exception proves the rule here. The only way to override the "code is law" model was to create a new coin, using the fact that a majority of miners voting for a particular new model means that becomes the new model - the creators just used their community weight to keep the old name. They most explicitly were not able to change the values in the old blockchain without the fork.

The exception shows there was no rule. The "rule" was "code is law, up until 51% of the network decides it isn't". If your transactions can be wiped out by a fork leaving you on a dwindling/minority version of the transaction history, you fundamentally cannot trust the system. "We only did it once" doesn't work, either, because if they'll do it once they'll do it again, and no amount of bombast will convince me (since, after all, they made bombastic assurances before they decided to make the first exception).

Also, "the exception proves the rule" is a misinterpretation of the phrase. "Proves" here means "puts to the test", and the saying means that you can tell whether a rule holds up by seeing what happens when it is tested. Ethereum demonstrated that the rule does not hold up.

Re: Investor Bulletin, July 25: Initial Coin Offerings

#45

Post by kbody »

the_stc wrote: post #36
omarchowdhury wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are single Silicon Valley startups that have raised that much though.

In 7 months?

Also with pretty much no due diligence, rarely any prototypes and a majority of infeasible promises.

Re: Investor Bulletin, July 25: Initial Coin Offerings

#46

Post by sethhochberg »

bpicolo wrote: post #2

> Ask whether the blockchain is open and public, whether the code has been published, and whether there has been an independent cybersecurity audit. That's an entirely prescient statement that suggests the SEC has done a serious bit of homework and has put careful thought into the subject.

Both the SEC and DoJ have done really remarkable jobs of keeping up with and publishing documentation related to cryptocurrencies and blockchains in general IMO. I remember thinking the same around the time the DoJ was auctioning off bitcoins seized from Silk Road - their site explaining what the auction was, what bitoins where, and why / how the auction would work suggested they really did understand what they were dealing with and was extremely clear technical writing.

Re: Investor Bulletin, July 25: Initial Coin Offerings

#47

Post by bpicolo »

sethhochberg wrote: post #46
bpicolo wrote: post #2

> Ask whether the blockchain is open and public, whether the code has been published, and whether there has been an independent cybersecurity audit. That's an entirely prescient statement that suggests the SEC has done a serious bit of homework and has put careful thought into the subject.

Both the SEC and DoJ have done really remarkable jobs of keeping up with and publishing documentation related to cryptocurrencies and blockchains in general IMO. I remember thinking the same around the time the DoJ was auctioning off bitcoins seized from Silk Road - their site explaining what the auction was, what bitoins where, and why / how the auction would work suggested they really did understand what they were…

The IRS has kept up on it too. My mother (a CPA) is aware of bitcoin through that.

Re: Investor Bulletin, July 25: Initial Coin Offerings

#48

Post by pgeorgep »

TheAceOfHearts wrote: post #17

I don't have anything to add to this discussion, but I just wanna say that I'm impressed by the bulletin's clarity. I'm used to reading government information that's difficult to parse and dive into. It's easy to fall into a belief that government agencies don't really know what they're doing, and it's just a bunch of monkeys banging at typewriters, but seeing clearly written posts discussing current and relevant eve…

I agree, the clarity of this piece speaks volumes to how serious the government is taking ICO's and crypto.

Re: Investor Bulletin, July 25: Initial Coin Offerings

#49

Post by pgeorgep »

ttul wrote: post #28
TheAceOfHearts wrote: post #17

I don't have anything to add to this discussion, but I just wanna say that I'm impressed by the bulletin's clarity. I'm used to reading government information that's difficult to parse and dive into. It's easy to fall into a belief that government agencies don't really know what they're doing, and it's just a bunch of monkeys banging at typewriters, but seeing clearly written posts discussing current and relevant eve…

$1.7B has been raised so far this year... it's a big deal.

It's a big deal because it seems like the only way startups can raise capital these days.

Re: Investor Bulletin, July 25: Initial Coin Offerings

#50

Post by jgalt212 »

pgeorgep wrote: post #49
ttul wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$1.7B has been raised so far this year... it's a big deal.

It's a big deal because it seems like the only way startups can raise capital these days.

That's inane. PE and VC have raised more funds last year than since the GFC. There's plenty of cash, more than enough, cash to go around without these illegal securities ICOs getting in the mix.

And when I say plenty of cash, I am talking in the aggregate. I don't make any statements about whether or not it's being correctly distributed.

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