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Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

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Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#41
post #9

> The past few days have been very difficult for many at the company, and we need to find a way to debate issues on which we might disagree ...So we've fired the person starting the debate? Am I missing something here?

As the note basically says; starting a debate does not excuse you from suggesting that some of your co-workers are there because of a "lowered bar", your evidence being psuedo-scientific bullshit about the tech-skill distribution among minorities and women.

> psuedo-scientific bullshit

A professor of social psychology at Rutgers said:

> The author of the Google essay on issues related to diversity gets nearly all of the science and its implications exactly right.

An evolutionary psychology professor said:

> For what it’s worth, I think that almost all of the Google memo’s empirical claims are scientifically accurate. Moreover, they are stated quite carefully and dispassionately. Its key claims about sex differences are especially well-supported by large volumes of research across species, cultures, and history. I know a little about sex differences research. On the topic of evolution and human sexuality, I’ve taught for 28 years, written 4 books and over 100 academic publications, given 190 talks, reviewed papers for over 50 journals, and mentored 11 Ph.D. students. Whoever the memo’s author is, he has obviously read a fair amount about these topics. Graded fairly, his memo would get at least an A- in any masters’ level psychology course. It is consistent with the scientific state of the art on sex differences. (Blank slate gender feminism is advocacy rather than science: no gender feminist I’ve met has ever been able to give a coherent answer to the question ‘What empirical findings would convince you that psychological sex differences evolved?’)

http://archive.is/z6xxP

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#42
post #24
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By firing the employee they're effectively sending out a strong message about it no matter how they sugarcoat it.

A strong message about breaking the code of conduct, yes. The message here seems abundantly clear and I have trouble understanding how it can miscontrued to be anything other than reacting to a clear violation. I can't even think of how to restate what is so clearly laid out in the note. I wouldn't rule out the potential that there is uneven enforcement of such violations, and that would make this action look questio…

[deleted]

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note that he says they are "described as", not that they are actually gender specific. The quotes also make it clear that he is referencing Damore's argument and pointing out an interest issue with it. He is not claiming that position as his own.

No. He's all but saying it. Mincing words may give a free pass in your book. Not in mine.

He explicitly says near the start of his article that he disagrees with the views on gender differences that the memo espouces, and that he's not getting into then because others are more qualified to do so.

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#44
post #10
post #5

Quoting Sundar Pichai (Google CEO), emphasis mine: > At the same time, there are co-workers who are questioning whether they can safely express their views in the workplace (especially those with a minority viewpoint) . They too feel under threat, and that is also not OK. People must feel free to express dissent. So to be clear again, many points raised in the memo—such as the portions criticizing Google’s trainings,…

I believe you have misconstrued the message Sundar was giving. The difference between having the freedom to speak one's mind, and breaching a code of conduct that you sign when you agree to work for Google is clear cut in his note.

Misconduct would be expressing these views under his blog while putting emphasis on Google and blaming his company for what he finds unreasonable.

He used internal messaging services. Someone leaked the document. That "someone" is sitting in his/her office today getting no punishment whatsoever.

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#45
post #24
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By firing the employee they're effectively sending out a strong message about it no matter how they sugarcoat it.

A strong message about breaking the code of conduct, yes. The message here seems abundantly clear and I have trouble understanding how it can miscontrued to be anything other than reacting to a clear violation. I can't even think of how to restate what is so clearly laid out in the note. I wouldn't rule out the potential that there is uneven enforcement of such violations, and that would make this action look questio…

When calling it a "code of conduct" does it refer to concrete actions, or just expressing opinions? Other than speech, what was the violation here? Restricting free speech by threat of firing is the solution everyone is applauding? Apparently Google is declaring an attitude in opposition to what they did: "many points raised in the memo ... are important topics. The author had a right to express their views on those topics...". But got fired as a result.

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#46

This thread seems to be a perfect demonstration of the problems when it comes to diversity in tech. People just don't seem to get it. I see the same thing in threads around big SV names sexually harassing women (and in those cases it blows my mind even more that people don't get that it's a problem). It seems like a lot of people are basing their opinions on logic (fine) but in a perfect world where everyone has equa…

Agreed. Many engineers seem to think if it's true then thry can just say it. To them it makes logical sense -- st least when it suits them.

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#47
post #5

Quoting Sundar Pichai (Google CEO), emphasis mine: > At the same time, there are co-workers who are questioning whether they can safely express their views in the workplace (especially those with a minority viewpoint) . They too feel under threat, and that is also not OK. People must feel free to express dissent. So to be clear again, many points raised in the memo—such as the portions criticizing Google’s trainings,…

It's worse than that. Ex-Googler Zunger is being celebrated for refuting Damore's argument by advancing gender stereotypes suggesting women naturally possess skills essential to the engineering process. > All of these traits which the manifesto described as “female” are the core traits which make someone successful at engineering https://medium.com/@yonatanzunger/so-about-this-googlers-man... How is it ok to push a g…

"It’s true that women are socialized to be better at paying attention to people’s emotional needs and so on — this is something that makes them better engineers, not worse ones."

Doesn't sound like a claim that women naturally possess these skills to me.

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#48
post #5

Quoting Sundar Pichai (Google CEO), emphasis mine: > At the same time, there are co-workers who are questioning whether they can safely express their views in the workplace (especially those with a minority viewpoint) . They too feel under threat, and that is also not OK. People must feel free to express dissent. So to be clear again, many points raised in the memo—such as the portions criticizing Google’s trainings,…

[deleted]

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#49
post #24
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By firing the employee they're effectively sending out a strong message about it no matter how they sugarcoat it.

A strong message about breaking the code of conduct, yes. The message here seems abundantly clear and I have trouble understanding how it can miscontrued to be anything other than reacting to a clear violation. I can't even think of how to restate what is so clearly laid out in the note. I wouldn't rule out the potential that there is uneven enforcement of such violations, and that would make this action look questio…

Not sure whether a management decision to remove the author is helping or hurting the goal to create an environment that isn't intimidating. ..because - compared to what was written in the memo - this is a very intimidating thing to do.

Re: Note to Google Employees from CEO Sundar Pichai

#50
post #5

Quoting Sundar Pichai (Google CEO), emphasis mine: > At the same time, there are co-workers who are questioning whether they can safely express their views in the workplace (especially those with a minority viewpoint) . They too feel under threat, and that is also not OK. People must feel free to express dissent. So to be clear again, many points raised in the memo—such as the portions criticizing Google’s trainings,…

We all know that men and women are different but under no circumstances can you club a large section of population and say they are inferior in some respect ... hitler did it with the Jews, whites did it to the blacks , Japanese did it to the Chinese and history is rife with extreme examples of the Dangers of generalization of a large section of population. Our job as human civilization is to evolve positively and to…

> say they are inferior in some respect

I do not believe that the author of the memo ever wrote anything like that. I'm not sure that you should equate all research scientists who published on gender/sex differences with nazis.

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