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Recovering from Burnout and Depression

kierantie.com

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Re: Recovering from Burnout and Depression

#41

Post by jakobegger »

55555 wrote: post #15

I think a big factor in burnout is that most work is ultimately meaningless, or even morally wrong, and on a deep level, we're aware of that. Why is it so hard to make yourself work? Probably because you actually should be doing something else with your life. If someone paid you money to kick a dog, you'd feel a strong urge to do something else. That's because you shouldn't kick dogs. But when we feel the same urge t…

I'd love to hear your meaningless idea that you know will make you a millionaire.

Re: Recovering from Burnout and Depression

#42

Post by chatmasta »

rjeli wrote: post #2

Why do I never read articles targeted at other high-stress jobs (lawyer, med student, etc etc)? Do software engineers have a unique culture that identifies this danger? Or are we the only ones that get burned out, maybe because of some self-selection into the field?

Probably just confirmation bias given the fact that a) you mostly read articles/blogs targeted at SWE professionals, and b) software engineers are far more likely to blog about their career experience than any other profession.

I'm sure if you read some trade magazines targeted at lawyers, etc you'd find similar sentiments.

Another, slightly more cynical interpretation is that software engineers are "special snowflakes" who are much more likely than legal/financial/medical professionals to complain about long hours and/or burnout. Interestingly those three professions all have gruelingly long hours and require you to "pay your dues" early in you career. Yet those professionals seem to complain far less, perhaps because the long hours are an expected part of their culture. After all, in finance people typically brag about how long they stayed at the office. So there is clearly some difference in work culture between the professions.

Re: Recovering from Burnout and Depression

#43

Post by failrate »

My recovery included a regimented sleeping, eating, and exercise plan that I introduced in stages. If you have to pick just one to start with, it is a toss up between going to sleep at the same time every night or going for a walk every day.

I also never work overtime anymore.

Still not totally okay, but not completely burnt out anymore.

Re: Recovering from Burnout and Depression

#44

Post by metaphorm »

maldusiecle wrote: post #23
55555 wrote: post #15

I think a big factor in burnout is that most work is ultimately meaningless, or even morally wrong, and on a deep level, we're aware of that. Why is it so hard to make yourself work? Probably because you actually should be doing something else with your life. If someone paid you money to kick a dog, you'd feel a strong urge to do something else. That's because you shouldn't kick dogs. But when we feel the same urge t…

I don't think this is true. Occupations that have very positive social impact can have very high burnout rates--it's not as if burnout and depression are unheard of among teachers and social workers, for instance. You're confusing cause and effect, to a certain degree. The feeling that your work is meaningless can be a symptom of burnout itself. People who do work that clearly improves other people's lives can still…

teaching itself is a noble profession, but teaching within the constraints, limitations, and structural flaws of the American public education institution can absolutely feel like "doing wrong" a lot of the time.

Re: Recovering from Burnout and Depression

#45

Post by ThrustVectoring »

55555 wrote: post #15

I think a big factor in burnout is that most work is ultimately meaningless, or even morally wrong, and on a deep level, we're aware of that. Why is it so hard to make yourself work? Probably because you actually should be doing something else with your life. If someone paid you money to kick a dog, you'd feel a strong urge to do something else. That's because you shouldn't kick dogs. But when we feel the same urge t…

In broad sense, loss of control is useful, since it credibly closes off options you don't want to take. You don't want to to take the option of putting up with slights and insults and loss of social standing, so you get mad and lose control, and people don't want to play that game with you any more. You don't want to take the option of abandoning your spouse and offspring, so you love them so deeply that you'd never consider it - and your public displays of affection prove it.

I think burnout fills the same sort of role. When people are constantly called to take on risky, stressful, and high effort activities - essentially, those that raise your cortisol levels - they burn out. Not just one-off ones, but repeatedly over long periods of time. So long-term high cortisol levels paint a picture of a certain narrative/social situation, where it's very much in your interest to "shirk" but you haven't been able to manage doing so because of narratives or social pressure. So your body "helpfully" removes the option of yielding to social pressure to rise to the occasion by making you unable to rise to the occasion in a way that cannot yield to the demands of others.

Re: Recovering from Burnout and Depression

#46

Post by metaphorm »

ggggtez wrote: post #29

Are there any studies on how long engineers take to recover from burnout? 6 months sounds about right from what I've heard anecdotally.

me too. 6 months is about how long it took me to recover from my own episode of burnout. I've spoken to several peers who report the same thing.

Re: Recovering from Burnout and Depression

#47

Post by a3n »

55555 wrote: post #15

I think a big factor in burnout is that most work is ultimately meaningless, or even morally wrong, and on a deep level, we're aware of that. Why is it so hard to make yourself work? Probably because you actually should be doing something else with your life. If someone paid you money to kick a dog, you'd feel a strong urge to do something else. That's because you shouldn't kick dogs. But when we feel the same urge t…

I left a job last year that was the most meaningful job I've ever had. Despite the benefit to society, and my appreciation of that fact, I left because of an indignity. I essentially gave someone else power over how I felt about myself.

Jobs are not just jobs, they're people too. You don't go to work and save the world every day, you mostly work with other people, which can be great, or it can be hell.

Re: Recovering from Burnout and Depression

#48

Post by circlefavshape »

kierantie wrote: post #36
bspn wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think a big factor in burnout is that most work is ultimately meaningless, or even morally wrong, and on a deep level, we're aware of that. I don't this is true across the board, but the challenge is finding a "job" that you love and are excited to tackle every day. This will differ for most people, but the closer you can get to doing something that you would voluntarily want to do even if you weren't being paid…

> Personally, I'm still searching for that magic job but through trial-and-error I'm getting pretty good at identifying what I don't want to do. Knowing what you DON'T want to do is sometimes more important and useful than knowing what you DO want to do!

I'm not so sure. I haven't found avoiding what you hate rather than pursuing what you love to be a good life strategy

Re: Recovering from Burnout and Depression

#49

Post by spatulon »

This struck pretty close to home. I quit my job because of burnout, and I'm currently on month five of what I expected to be a two or three month break before finding another job. I still don't feel ready to go back into the real world.

Like the author, work overload was not the problem - I almost never worked more than 40 hours per week. Finding support from family/friends has been difficult; I've been desperately trying to avoid the stigma attached to the word ｄｅｐｒｅｓｓｉｏｎ, and as a result I don't think many people realise what I've been going through, and assume I've just decided to bum around for a bit.

Re: Recovering from Burnout and Depression

#50

Post by germinalphrase »

marsrover wrote: post #37
maldusiecle wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is true. Occupations that have very positive social impact can have very high burnout rates--it's not as if burnout and depression are unheard of among teachers and social workers, for instance. You're confusing cause and effect, to a certain degree. The feeling that your work is meaningless can be a symptom of burnout itself. People who do work that clearly improves other people's lives can still…

I can imagine there are many teachers and social workers who burn out due to feeling like they're not making an impact no matter how hard they try. I don't think he's confusing cause and effect. There are instances where burnout is caused by a lack of purpose provided by the job. Just because there are instances of work feeling meaningless caused by burnout, doesn't mean the inverse cannot happen. > People who do wor…

They also burn out from work load. In my city, county social workers have a case load of ~60 youth they are supposed to be meeting with and providing services to every week. They are clearly being set up to fail.

Consequently, the yearly turnover rate is approximately 30 percent.

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