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Spotify’s Beta Used ‘Pirate’ MP3 Files, Some from Pirate Bay

torrentfreak.com

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Re: Spotify’s Beta Used ‘Pirate’ MP3 Files, Some from Pirate Bay

#41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So how many journals and forums do you subscribe to in order to find out what the programs installed on your computer are doing?

This is not a counterargument. P2P is not something that most people would understand and thus, including it in marketing materials would turn people off. Thus, not including it in marketing materials is not a sign of intentional deception. I can't go back in time but I bet if you googled "spotify p2p" or "spotify architecture" in 2012 you'd find a wealth of information on it

You, and several other people in this conversation, are trying to tell the person you originally replied to how to feel.

They said nothing but "this is how I felt, this is why I stopped using it". If I had a bad experience with some software, I too would uninstall it, even if I'm told "but you see, you didn't experience it correctly".

Re: Spotify’s Beta Used ‘Pirate’ MP3 Files, Some from Pirate Bay

#43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was amazing. A massive library of obscure releases across all genres. Merzbow box set, thousands and thousands of country LPs, music from African and Asian countries. Gradually it got whittled down to what certain labels would agree to.

You can stream torrents [0], how long until someone makes a Spotify clone using torrents with a curated home page and integrated torrent search? Like Popcorntime and Netflix? You could re-sell a one click VPN for revenue.

It's been on my backlog for quite a while at this time.

Re: Spotify’s Beta Used ‘Pirate’ MP3 Files, Some from Pirate Bay

#44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was amazing. A massive library of obscure releases across all genres. Merzbow box set, thousands and thousands of country LPs, music from African and Asian countries. Gradually it got whittled down to what certain labels would agree to.

You can stream torrents [0], how long until someone makes a Spotify clone using torrents with a curated home page and integrated torrent search? Like Popcorntime and Netflix? You could re-sell a one click VPN for revenue.

I forgot to add links

http://butterproject.org

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popcorn_Time

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BitTorrent

Re: Spotify’s Beta Used ‘Pirate’ MP3 Files, Some from Pirate Bay

#45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way they butchered what was my all-time favorite arcade game "Killer Instinct" with the SNES port and then KI Gold for the N64. I have never been able to forgive the company.

err... did you ever consider that perhaps those systems weren't actually powerful enough to support the "full" Killer Instinct experience, so there was no way for it not to seem "downgraded" from the real deal? (I was in my early 20's when that came out in the arcades. I remember it well)

The SNES certainly wasn't able to reproduce the arcade experience. The N64 should have been.

Over the years, I have considered buying an old arcade cabinet just to re-experience the magic.

I just need to find the space for it.

Re: Spotify’s Beta Used ‘Pirate’ MP3 Files, Some from Pirate Bay

#46
post #19

One thing I noticed a few years ago, was that Spotify was using a massive amount more upload bandwidth than download. Upon digging it actually appeared they were streaming FROM my computer, similar to how a torrenting system works. I'm assuming their current platform is doing something similar. If this is indeed the case, they can stream music to everyone's phones / computers, then use their network to stream to thei…

There is a common element here. The original developer of uTorrent sold his product to BitTorrent and teamed up with the Spotify guys as the key engineer, and was critical to the success of the early product. Ludvig is a badass. He's been one of my favorite programmers since the early uTorrent days. That's why Spotify was such a good product back in beta, he basically had control over everything technical. Thus the P…

"Of course, Spotify sucks now".

Spotify is awesome and convenient. In comparison to other services, for me as a user, it's a clear winner.

Re: Spotify’s Beta Used ‘Pirate’ MP3 Files, Some from Pirate Bay

#47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not a counterargument. P2P is not something that most people would understand and thus, including it in marketing materials would turn people off. Thus, not including it in marketing materials is not a sign of intentional deception. I can't go back in time but I bet if you googled "spotify p2p" or "spotify architecture" in 2012 you'd find a wealth of information on it

You, and several other people in this conversation, are trying to tell the person you originally replied to how to feel. They said nothing but "this is how I felt, this is why I stopped using it". If I had a bad experience with some software, I too would uninstall it, even if I'm told "but you see, you didn't experience it correctly".

They are of course entitled to their feelings, but saying that Spotify was doing something nefarious is unreasonable. Being able to send a receive information is part of how the Internet is supposed to work. That's what's makes it different from other things like cable TV.

It's DRM, data caps and walled gardens that have convinced people otherwise. The next logical step is separating clients and servers altogether. Why should I pay for data if I'm only a consumer? In that case we might as well let youtube and netflix pay to deliver the content. And then it's back to cable TV again.

PS. You also have to remember that Spotify is 10 years old. Internet infrastructure and things like cloud offerings wasn't as good. It wasn't just a move to save bandwidth, but to actually be able to offer a good service (low latency, high throughput, for free). Which still isn't easy.

Re: Spotify’s Beta Used ‘Pirate’ MP3 Files, Some from Pirate Bay

#48
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a common element here. The original developer of uTorrent sold his product to BitTorrent and teamed up with the Spotify guys as the key engineer, and was critical to the success of the early product. Ludvig is a badass. He's been one of my favorite programmers since the early uTorrent days. That's why Spotify was such a good product back in beta, he basically had control over everything technical. Thus the P…

"Of course, Spotify sucks now". Spotify is awesome and convenient. In comparison to other services, for me as a user, it's a clear winner.

In comparison to the other garbage, yeah it might be the winner. But it's still garbage.

I was one of the first users of the beta program. At the time, Ludvig's philosophy of simplicity + hidden functionality via interactive views shone through the UI and it was very pleasant to use. The 5 star rating system was the icing on the cake. A step down in functionality from Amarok's playlist creation system, and lacking the fine search and organization capabilities of foobar2000, but it did the job.

However, the UX of Spotify has hideously morphed over time. Now the UI mostly uses Chromium Embedded Framework which brings huge overhead and causes lots of rendering latency. The font size and padding has grown, then shrunk, then grown again, each time showing less tracks on a page at once. Views that were once interactive with left and right clicks became static. Star ratings turned into Like/Unlike.

Their user behavior tracking has naturally been cranked up to 11, though it is better than a lot of similar products, I still have no desire for a music service to track anything other than the music I search and play. Even tracking the song titles in my personal library is an unacceptable breach of privacy.

The slow and steady social creep and tracking through Facebook is also unacceptable.

It doesn't utilize P2P anymore, which I considered a plus because I love supporting and legitimizing P2P tech.

It has become less of an engineer-led company and more of a traditional company with shareholder interests

I could really go on. The downsides of Spotify as a music player are much greater than they were at product launch.

The most infuriating thing about it is that Spotify never fielded these changes with users before committing to them, and each and every time when a simple addition to the settings panel could make the changes optional, they were instead forced upon us.

I don't like a music player that frequently changes its UI without my approval. I like a music player that puts me in charge of the UI.

I no longer pay for Spotify and have returned to getting my music through other means.

On my Linux and Windows machines, I mostly use foobar2000 and VLC, and Amarok when I need powerful playlisting tools. If Radionomy ever gets their shit straight with Winamp (They bought it from AOL in '14 and have to clean out all proprietary code) then I will definitely consider going back.

Give me a streaming service that doesn't spy on me unnecessarily and has an API so that I can implement a plugin to my favorite existing media player or otherwise an absolutely beautiful and immutable interface, and of course a large library and doesn't shaft its artists, and I will pay for it. Anything less than that, in 2017, sucks.

Re: Spotify’s Beta Used ‘Pirate’ MP3 Files, Some from Pirate Bay

#49

One thing I noticed a few years ago, was that Spotify was using a massive amount more upload bandwidth than download. Upon digging it actually appeared they were streaming FROM my computer, similar to how a torrenting system works. I'm assuming their current platform is doing something similar. If this is indeed the case, they can stream music to everyone's phones / computers, then use their network to stream to thei…

I strongly suspect, but cannot prove, that Skype was also exfiltrating audio files from the clients PC at one time.

When they opened their high-quality audio service the songs had clear artifacts of having been encoded more than once. If you had access to the original uncompressed audio stream, you'd simply encode a higher quality version. Many albums weren't available for high quality streaming at all.

The logical explanation was they didn't have a database of lossless audio from which to re-encode, and we already knew they were using P2P. Why not use the P2P to raid users music collections as well.

Re: Spotify’s Beta Used ‘Pirate’ MP3 Files, Some from Pirate Bay

#50

One thing I noticed a few years ago, was that Spotify was using a massive amount more upload bandwidth than download. Upon digging it actually appeared they were streaming FROM my computer, similar to how a torrenting system works. I'm assuming their current platform is doing something similar. If this is indeed the case, they can stream music to everyone's phones / computers, then use their network to stream to thei…

> It's not at all surprising that their initial "success" is tied to torrenting as well. Two founders of Spotify came from uTorrent after the sale.[1][2] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Ek [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludvig_Strigeus

[2] is not a co-founder, according to [1] the co founder is Martin Lorentzon.
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