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Getting out of the cloud…

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Re: Getting out of the cloud…

#41

Post by askmike »

milesrout wrote: post #37
lern_too_spel wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be clear, you're proposing that users download their entire email storage to their phones and browsers before they can search or spam filter their email? And you think that this would be a compelling product for the average email user? I'm having a hard time figuring out if you're trolling.

Yes, people are proposing that people download their email. How is that controversial? That's how email works. It's not like emails are large.

A huge number of emails plus attachments are large in size. It is that controversial because it is hard to make it perform on a mobile device over a crappy 3g connection.

Re: Getting out of the cloud…

#42

Post by Veratyr »

Freak_NL wrote: post #33
beejiu wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aren't the data centers technically owned by Amazon Ireland for compliance (cough tax) reasons? Amazon clearly state that data never moves out of the region.

As long as Amazon has a US presence, it, and the data is hosts, is within legal reach of US judges and government.

This isn't yet decided. Microsoft and the DoJ are still arguing about this in the court system, which so far has ruled that the US government cannot compel Microsoft to release data it holds in Ireland. It's currently waiting for the DoJ to decide whether to take it to the Supreme Court: http://www.politico.com/blogs/under-the-radar/2017/01/micros...

Re: Getting out of the cloud…

#43

Post by Veratyr »

sghiassy wrote: post #13

Can anyone recommend a European alternative for Amazon AWS?

If you want a straight AWS "cloud" replacement, there aren't many options. OVH and LeaseWeb are the most likely candidates but don't come close to the breadth of offerings.

There's a very large and competitive market for dedicated servers and colocation though and depending on your load, it might be worth a look at switching to dedicated or leased infrastructure.

Owning the hardware is the only way to truly control your destiny as far as I'm concerned.

Re: Getting out of the cloud…

#44

Post by hvidgaard »

lern_too_spel wrote: post #17
surferbayarea wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The inverted index could simply be built/live on client side. The cloud is then just a backup data storage. Encrypted email is downloaded, unencrypted and indexed on your laptop/phone etc.

To be clear, you're proposing that users download their entire email storage to their phones and browsers before they can search or spam filter their email? And you think that this would be a compelling product for the average email user? I'm having a hard time figuring out if you're trolling.

You don't need to store the data locally, you can just store indexes and filters. Keep them up to date in an online fashion and the cost is a fraction of the storage space required, and some extra CPU time spend locally.

Re: Getting out of the cloud…

#45

Post by tremon »

pjc50 wrote: post #32
ktta wrote: post #4

Can any one please explain in layman terms what this means a bit more clearly? I think I understood the part where the US no longer a good place to store data, and that there are no proper privacy laws protecting foreign citizens' data that is stored on US soil. So basically, if you still want to have a proper privacy policy, GTFO your data to non-US servers ASAP. Anything else? Something I've gotten wrong?

EU law requires certain protections for data classed as "personal data" and "sensitive personal data". It especially requires that "Personal data shall not be transferred to a country or territory outside the European Economic Area unless that country or territory ensures an adequate level of protection for the rights and freedoms of data subjects in relation to the processing of personal data". There was an agreemen…

To add to that: Safe Harbor had already been ruled inadequate in 2015 by the European Court of Justice, in light of the Snowden revelations. A new agreement (Privacy Shield) had been drafted and signed in 2016, even though it was considered equally inadequate by everyone except the European Commission.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privacy_Shield

Re: Getting out of the cloud…

#46

Post by TeMPOraL »

emptyfile wrote: post #38

Starting to think the Trump presidency will be great for Europe, by making it politically unfeasible for European politicians to continue pretending the US is a good ally, leader of the free world, champion of liberal values, etc... The US fifth column voluntarily leaving the EU will surely expedite the process.

> Starting to think the Trump presidency will be great for Europe

I'm in Europe and I'm getting seriously worried the US will start the Third World War within coming months...

Re: Getting out of the cloud…

#47

Post by wattt »

tex0 wrote: post #29
lwhalen wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Profitbricks. cloudscale.ch. If you want to go self-hosted, talk to fuzzy-logic.org.

Indeed, these providers offer "virtual servers" as well, but if look beyond that they play an entirely different game than AWS. The only relevant competitors to AWS are Google and maybe MS Azure. Both also US companies. No one else is anywhere near the level of scale and expertise AWS has.

I would add Digital Ocean as a lower tier, they seem to have provisioning plugins for everything I use (mostly Vagrant) but I roll my own DNS and load balancing. Still US-based unfortunately.

Re: Getting out of the cloud…

#49

Post by beejiu »

Freak_NL wrote: post #33
beejiu wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aren't the data centers technically owned by Amazon Ireland for compliance (cough tax) reasons? Amazon clearly state that data never moves out of the region.

As long as Amazon has a US presence, it, and the data is hosts, is within legal reach of US judges and government.

That sounds very dangerous. What would happen if Amazon simply had a 99% share, but 1% was held by another purely Irish company. Amazon might elect the board and the subsidiary might 'lease' intellectual property and capital from the parent company, but I don't see how you could argue it is subject to US law in any way.

Re: Getting out of the cloud…

#50

Post by beejiu »

Veratyr wrote: post #42
Freak_NL wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As long as Amazon has a US presence, it, and the data is hosts, is within legal reach of US judges and government.

This isn't yet decided. Microsoft and the DoJ are still arguing about this in the court system, which so far has ruled that the US government cannot compel Microsoft to release data it holds in Ireland. It's currently waiting for the DoJ to decide whether to take it to the Supreme Court: http://www.politico.com/blogs/under-the-radar/2017/01/micros...

Even if the DoJ did make it law, it would surely conflict with law that the Irish domiciled entity is subject to.
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