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Dear Dash Users – A message to all Dash users from the Kapeli Blog

blog.kapeli.com

41–50 of 110 posts

Re: Dear Dash Users – A message to all Dash users from the Kapeli Blog

#41
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, Kapeli recorded and uploaded the phone call, shooting himself in the foot.

Call it what you will, but it's the only time in this whole story that hasn't been "he said, she said."

And given that nugget of actual evidence, I can decisively say that he definitely screwed himself over.

This is how the business world works. Sometimes you can't get the best deal, but it's still in your best interest to accept it regardless. You have to act rationally; you can't just defect (to borrow some game theory parlance -- this literally resembles Prisoner's Dilemma) in the name of "principles."

One moderately-crafted blog post later (saying Apple wasn't at fault, and he wasn't either -- his account was "only" linked to the other one), this guy would have been back in business. It's no surprise that this guy hasn't ever worked at a big company before, if you don't swallow your pride every so often and keep your mouth shut, you get kicked to the curb, and it's surreal that he was a self-professed businessman because of how often this happens in the game.

He WAS winning, and he would've won (nobody would've taken his PR damage control post seriously, and initially everyone believed his fabricated narrative of innocence), but he royally #$!@ed up because he thought he could've had his cake and eaten it too.

I can't under any circumstances imagine any possible outcome to this scenario where Apple would've both admitted wrongdoing AND reinstated his app. Let's not get too greedy here...

Re: Dear Dash Users – A message to all Dash users from the Kapeli Blog

#42
post #22

This whole thing has taught me a lesson. I initially sided with the weaker side because I own a copy of Dash, and it is great software, and because one tends to side with the underdog. After listening to the recording of the conversation, my feeling is that Apple is handling this in a very fair and professional way, and that I was too quick to take sides. I think it is not unreasonable to assume that: same credit car…

I generally agree with you but wanted to point out that: > same credit card + same hardware = same developer is fine as a pseudo-identifier for fraud detection...but I don't think is actually an identifier. It's kind of like someone knowing my social security number and birthday but not actually being me. IMO, Apple should have immediately reinstated the account once contacted about a potential edge case rather than…

You probably use less information to uniquely identify users in apps that you write. Assuming you write apps in the first place.

Re: Dear Dash Users – A message to all Dash users from the Kapeli Blog

#43
post #4

This guy has shown quite a talent for self-sabotage. Apple was willing to reinstate him if he'd undo some of the PR damage he'd created by spelling out that he shared the credit card with someone, and that maybe that's not the best idea. Instead, he was enjoying the spotlight so much, he used the opportunity to escalate further, even publishing his phone call with Apple (illegal on one side of that conversation at le…

"(illegal on one side of that conversation at least)." This is actually not correct, it depends on the state/country he is in.

Also, you don't know if there was consent before the recording started.

Re: Dear Dash Users – A message to all Dash users from the Kapeli Blog

#44
post #22

This whole thing has taught me a lesson. I initially sided with the weaker side because I own a copy of Dash, and it is great software, and because one tends to side with the underdog. After listening to the recording of the conversation, my feeling is that Apple is handling this in a very fair and professional way, and that I was too quick to take sides. I think it is not unreasonable to assume that: same credit car…

I generally agree with you but wanted to point out that: > same credit card + same hardware = same developer is fine as a pseudo-identifier for fraud detection...but I don't think is actually an identifier. It's kind of like someone knowing my social security number and birthday but not actually being me. IMO, Apple should have immediately reinstated the account once contacted about a potential edge case rather than…

[deleted]

Re: Dear Dash Users – A message to all Dash users from the Kapeli Blog

#45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I generally agree with you but wanted to point out that: > same credit card + same hardware = same developer is fine as a pseudo-identifier for fraud detection...but I don't think is actually an identifier. It's kind of like someone knowing my social security number and birthday but not actually being me. IMO, Apple should have immediately reinstated the account once contacted about a potential edge case rather than…

You probably use less information to uniquely identify users in apps that you write. Assuming you write apps in the first place.

Generally, I uniquely identify users by PK sequences on a table with UNIQUE constraints on various pieces of User data.

So if Apple had made credit cards and/or test devices UNIQUE to a given account then sure...but that's not what they did here did they?

Re: Dear Dash Users – A message to all Dash users from the Kapeli Blog

#46
post #17

There feels like no right side in this story. * Apple terminated both accounts because of fraudulent activity, but only one account was contacted to let them know of this activity. * Kapeli shared financial information and test devices with this other account, whether it was a relative or not. * Apple said "Hey, write a post telling the whole story and all will be cleared. Just don't say we were at fault." * Kapeli a…

Generally, I don't get this: * Kapeli shared financial information and test devices with this other account, whether it was a relative or not. The assumption here is that for some reason a credit card number and device identifiers (unclear where they come from...but maybe mac address?) are enough for Apple to "link" accounts. I contest this for the same reason I think someone knowing my birthday and social security n…

Even though I disagree with your post, I upvoted it to counter the people on this site who downvote merely because they disagree with somebody's comment.

Re: Dear Dash Users – A message to all Dash users from the Kapeli Blog

#47
post #17

There feels like no right side in this story. * Apple terminated both accounts because of fraudulent activity, but only one account was contacted to let them know of this activity. * Kapeli shared financial information and test devices with this other account, whether it was a relative or not. * Apple said "Hey, write a post telling the whole story and all will be cleared. Just don't say we were at fault." * Kapeli a…

>Apple said "Hey, write a post telling the whole story and all will be cleared. Just don't say we were at fault."

Why should Apple tell devs what to publish on their blogs? That does seem like blackmail: say you are sorry and we will let you back in.

Re: Dear Dash Users – A message to all Dash users from the Kapeli Blog

#48
Apple has known this fraud reviews for a long while, we are talking about 1000s and a time line of two years. I am wondering Apple would normally have terminated the account long ago if DASH wasn't a popular app.

I read a lot of the previous HN thread saying Apple blackmailing him. This point would be correct if you consider Apple was wrong, and this Guy borrowing his credit card AND account to this "relative" ( Which we still dont know if he/she exist ) committing Fraud bare ZERO responsibility for himself.

This is like iFixit tearing up the new AppleTV before NDA and being cocky about it.

I mean seriously, what the hell is wrong with these people?

Re: Dear Dash Users – A message to all Dash users from the Kapeli Blog

#49
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Call it what you will, but it's the only time in this whole story that hasn't been "he said, she said."

And given that nugget of actual evidence, I can decisively say that he definitely screwed himself over. This is how the business world works. Sometimes you can't get the best deal, but it's still in your best interest to accept it regardless. You have to act rationally; you can't just defect (to borrow some game theory parlance -- this literally resembles Prisoner's Dilemma) in the name of "principles." One moderatel…

It's not a fact that had he written a blog post admitting guilt that his account would have been reinstated. That's just a carrot dangled by Apple, without a hard contractual obligation to follow through.

If anything, actually writing that something wrong happened would make it easier for them to justify their decision. It could be a trick representatives sometimes use when they assume the party they are dealing with is guilty. It's admitting to fraud and can hurt him more, especially if it didn't work out. And they can always reverse their decision.

Re: Dear Dash Users – A message to all Dash users from the Kapeli Blog

#50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You probably use less information to uniquely identify users in apps that you write. Assuming you write apps in the first place.

Generally, I uniquely identify users by PK sequences on a table with UNIQUE constraints on various pieces of User data. So if Apple had made credit cards and/or test devices UNIQUE to a given account then sure...but that's not what they did here did they?

So yes, you use a single token. Apple used a token and a credit card number. That's two pieces of identifying information.
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