Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds • Hacker News Board

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#41

Post by tasty_freeze » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 6:46 PM UTC

mariodiana wrote: post #14

eternalban wrote: post #9

I had a conversation with a Japanese American artist a couple of years ago on the general topic of the post-WWII infantilization of Japanese culture. I believe we reached a sort of mild agreement that Japan's collective unconscious is still trying to process the shock of being on the receiving end of a nuclear attack.

Please, can you give some details about this "infantilization"? I can't be the only one who can't think of anything other than Hello Kitty.

I'm not expert on Japanese culture. This comment comes from my experience 20 years ago I spent about six weeks in Japan, four of them working in an office in Kyoto and doing the daily commute on the train (the real reason I was there).

One thing that jumped out at me was what appeared to be a widespread fetish where the ideal woman looked like a cupie doll type school girl, almost like a living anime character.

There were also a lot of free "manga" around (anime magazines) and not only where these schoolgirl characters everywhere, raping them was a common theme.

I loved my short stay in Japan, and I had a lot of positive experiences there, but that aspect of the culture was downright creepy.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#42

Post by hasenj » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 6:46 PM UTC

sambe wrote: post #16

mariodiana wrote: post #15

> There was one clearly positive indicator in the survey: For the first time, the proportion of women returning to work after having their first child in Japan's once notoriously patriarchal society exceeded 50 percent. In all seriousness, if the concern is low birthrates, how is the above a "clearly positive indicator"?

The concern expressed in this sentence is that of a patriarchal society.

The sentiment expressed in _your_ sentence is that of a radical feminist.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#43

Post by hasenj » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 6:47 PM UTC

unsignedint wrote: post #17

mariodiana wrote: post #15

> There was one clearly positive indicator in the survey: For the first time, the proportion of women returning to work after having their first child in Japan's once notoriously patriarchal society exceeded 50 percent. In all seriousness, if the concern is low birthrates, how is the above a "clearly positive indicator"?

Because women can be discouraged of having a children in fear of not being return to work afterward. Implementations of maternity leaves are not very high in Japan -- this is coming from the work that histrically, they were expected to leave the work force when women are married.

Who is going to take care of the baby?

Also, returning to work probably means no intention of having another baby any time soon.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#44

Post by api » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 6:48 PM UTC

Animats wrote: post #36

Japan has a fertility rate of 1.41. Replacement rate is around 2.1 to maintain the population. Here's the world table.[1] Most of the developed world is below replacement rate. Most of Africa is above 4. India is at 2.51; China is at 1.55. Singapore is at the bottom at 0.8. It's amazing to see that much variation between countries. Maybe Japan shouldn't have cracked down on love hotels. [1] http://www.indexmundi.com/…

Mortality rates in places like Africa are also much higher, and life spans are lower. The two seem inversely proportional.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#45

Post by clydethefrog » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 6:51 PM UTC

mjevans wrote: post #34

fjejfjrjdjc wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the real issue, and it's where we're headed as well in the west. Unfortunately, we'll probably suffer through this completely avoidable problem because politicians are too beholden to business interests.

With the two recent recession dips and the long slog of recovery that doesn't seem to have any real vigor, I think the west might already be on this trajectory instead of merely headed there.

Yes, see The strange case of the missing baby [2016]

http://www.economist.com/news/international/21697817-financi...

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#46

Post by honkhonkpants » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 6:54 PM UTC

reflexive wrote: post #21

mariodiana wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please, can you give some details about this "infantilization"? I can't be the only one who can't think of anything other than Hello Kitty.

The original "Gojira" (Godzilla) in 1954 has been regarded as an expression of the impotence and powerlessness felt by many Japanese after being forced to surrender to the Allies in WW2, and the subsequent American occupation. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/film/10788996/Godzilla-wh...

Interesting perspective. Defeat was the consequence of having started the war in the first place. Nobody in America was sitting around in 1941 thinking up ways to vaporize Japanese people. As they say on the Internet: play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#47

Post by mangecoeur » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 7:00 PM UTC

Perhaps the darker side that could be missed is that despite their demographic problem, Japan continues to refuse to let in more young foreigners in to help balance the demographics.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#48

Post by feklar » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 7:03 PM UTC

OSButler wrote: post #35

It would be interesting to hear the point of view from a Japanese on those numbers. How is the dating scene? Are those numbers surprising or matching with your own experiences?

According to 4/2chan posters from Japan it's all about money. Men are expected to have a career by age 30something and be set for a family, if they don't it's seen as shameful so they don't try to date. Too many low paying jobs, with fleeting job security, and no support for single women to raise a family.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#49

Post by M_Grey » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 7:04 PM UTC

mangecoeur wrote: post #47

Perhaps the darker side that could be missed is that despite their demographic problem, Japan continues to refuse to let in more young foreigners in to help balance the demographics.

Japan isn't going to change in that regard anytime soon. They'd definitely rather have less Japanese people, and have them still be what they consider "Japanese" enough. Japan has many wonderful aspects to it, but the racism and nationalism are not part of them.

Re: Japan has a worrying number of virgins, government finds

#50

Post by clydethefrog » Sat, Sep 17, 2016, 7:06 PM UTC

scythe wrote: post #26

What is concerning is this: >Most people surveyed said they want to get married at some point. This isn't delineated by gender, so I interpret it as meaning that Japanese men and women both want to get married -- but they aren't enough for each other. >A booming industry surrounds Japan's growing condition of loneliness, a phenomenon at once quite particular to the Japanese, yet also a glimpse into a future where man…

Is it wrong for me to see that devaluation of human relationship in your linked thesis as Marx's theory of alienation without the capitalist critique?

>The theoretic basis of alienation, within the capitalist mode of production, is that the worker invariably loses the ability to determine life and destiny, when deprived of the right to think (conceive) of themselves as the director of their own actions; to determine the character of said actions; to define relationships with other people.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marx%27s_theory_of_alienation