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Docker for Mac Beta Review

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Re: Docker for Mac Beta Review

#41

Post by nzoschke »

shykes wrote: post #28
tacos wrote: post #3

This "review" is the technical equivalent of a YouTube unboxing video. Screenshot, screenshot, something I already knew from reading the press release, screenshot, platitude, one big technical error in the conclusion, and done. If it really worked (especially on Windows) Docker would post the binaries instead of treating this like Wonka Golden Tickets. Love Docker, am actually waiting to be approved so I can get to b…

Disclaimer: I work at Docker. The reason we are keeping the beta private is because we don't believe the quality is good enough yet to "open the floodgates". We are sending as many invites as the engineers are comfortable with - currently that's several thousands per day. As we hit more and more edge cases (performance, stability, support for unusual configurations...) we are expanding the pool as fast as we can.

Hey Solomon!

Author of the post here.

I'll second your ask for patience.

If you've been following along, incredibly smart people have been experimenting with Docker and xhyve for a long time now.

I feel like I've been waiting for close to a year for a solution this good. Testing and trying lots of permutations on a Mac.

I was very excited by the beta announcement and was fine waiting for Docker to send invites at whatever pace makes sense for them.

I'll also still patient while the Docker team works out the countless new bugs they will find as people use this far and wide.

I'll also keep doing my part to help people be very successful developing and deploying with Docker.

Thanks for the hard work.

Re: Docker for Mac Beta Review

#42

Post by avsm »

bryanh wrote: post #31

I've noticed some pretty extreme performance penalties with Docker for Mac. Wherein VirtualBox would spin I'm going to guess it'll get better in time. It would be nice to get some insight into just what is burning CPU cycles. The experience besides that was really top notch IMO.

[I work on Docker for Mac]

The early betas focussed on feature completeness rather than performance for filesystem sharing. In particular, we have implemented a new "osxfs" that implements bidirectional translation between Linux and OSX filesystems, including inotify/FSEvents and uid/guid mapping between the host and the container. Getting the semantics right took a while, and all the recent betas have been steadily gaining in performance as we implement more optimisations in the data paths.

If you do spot any pathological "spinning cases" where a particular container operation appears to spiking the CPU more than it should be in, we'd like to know about it so we can fix it. Reproducible Dockerfiles on the Hub are particularly appreciated so that we can add them to the regression tests.

Re: Docker for Mac Beta Review

#43

Post by dandandan »

tln wrote: post #37
shuzchen wrote: post #13

Can anybody in HN provide a quickpath into the beta? I signed up when it was first announced (seems to be over 30 days ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11352389 ) but haven't heard anything back yet.

I am in the same boat. I'm actually holding up a wider scope for Docker deployment within our organization until we can use Docker for Mac.

Why does needing to use docker-machine prevent you from rolling out docker within your org?

Re: Docker for Mac Beta Review

#45

Post by girvo »

bryanh wrote: post #31

I've noticed some pretty extreme performance penalties with Docker for Mac. Wherein VirtualBox would spin I'm going to guess it'll get better in time. It would be nice to get some insight into just what is burning CPU cycles. The experience besides that was really top notch IMO.

Oh, really? I've been running boot2docker-xhyve for months now, and performance-wise it's been far better than VirtualBox. I wonder if its a quirk of how Docker for Mac is set up?

Re: Docker for Mac Beta Review

#46

Post by bpicolo »

tln wrote: post #37
shuzchen wrote: post #13

Can anybody in HN provide a quickpath into the beta? I signed up when it was first announced (seems to be over 30 days ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11352389 ) but haven't heard anything back yet.

I am in the same boat. I'm actually holding up a wider scope for Docker deployment within our organization until we can use Docker for Mac.

https://github.com/nlf/dlite is a pretty good placeholder. Only thing it stumbles a lot on in my experience is if your containers need to hit a VPN.

Re: Docker for Mac Beta Review

#47

Post by toong »

tln wrote: post #37
shuzchen wrote: post #13

Can anybody in HN provide a quickpath into the beta? I signed up when it was first announced (seems to be over 30 days ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11352389 ) but haven't heard anything back yet.

I am in the same boat. I'm actually holding up a wider scope for Docker deployment within our organization until we can use Docker for Mac.

Docker Machine on OS/X works very well ?

Re: Docker for Mac Beta Review

#48

Post by dandandan »

garadox wrote: post #33
Matt3o12_ wrote: post #4

Why do people value that so much? I really don't care if a tiny VMis running in the background. Also, running that VM gives me more confidence that it will also run on the production machine (since they use the same kernel and the same docker version). The only problem I had with docker was that I did not use to support shared volumes that are outside the home folder on Mac (I think they changed that now, but I'm not…

If you want to run services in docker containers with Docker Toolbox (e.g. a mysql db), and you want the db stored on the Mac host, then you have to worry about 2 layers of folder mounts (one from host -> vm, one from vm -> container), another 2 layers of port forwarding (same as above), to make it 'feel' like your're running mysql locally. With the beta, all of that is taken care for you with a couple of settings, a…

That's still the case with docker for Mac. Swapping xhyve for virtualbox doesn't eliminate the port forwarding or device mounting.

Re: Docker for Mac Beta Review

#49

Post by girvo »

Matt3o12_ wrote: post #40
garadox wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want to run services in docker containers with Docker Toolbox (e.g. a mysql db), and you want the db stored on the Mac host, then you have to worry about 2 layers of folder mounts (one from host -> vm, one from vm -> container), another 2 layers of port forwarding (same as above), to make it 'feel' like your're running mysql locally. With the beta, all of that is taken care for you with a couple of settings, a…

Even boot2docker (docker machines predecessor) could do that. It shared the folders correctly and managed port forwarding. Of course localhost stop working but I just added the ip in /etc/hosts and enter docker.local instead (the docks say the IP might change but that's never happened to me).

> It shared the folders correctly

Except on Mac, where it sometimes doesn't. Have you not run into permissions issues? Or having a file-watcher process running in the container not being triggered by changes from the host? There are a tonne of quirks that came with boot2docker. It was worth it, of course, but they were still there; and this app is specifically aiming to address them.

Re: Docker for Mac Beta Review

#50

Post by kevan »

SilasX wrote: post #16
Osiris wrote: post #6

I'm a node.js developer. I understand the benefit of using docker for deployments or CI testing, but I have yet to be convinced of the benefits of using it for development on my local machine. I install node, postgres, and redis natively and it all works fine. What benefits does docker provide to my workflow?

Wait, not even another kind of VM? Have you ever had to work with a team that has an unreliable environment? And had to walk them through debugging an error message for installing one of them, or wanted to add something with further dependencies? (Not to say Docker's immune from that; the sudden deprecation of docker-compose for docker-machine was a nasty surprise.)

>the sudden deprecation of docker-compose for docker-machine was a nasty surprise.

I think you meant the deprecation of Boot2Docker?

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