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Aphantasia: How It Feels to Be Blind in Your Mind

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Re: Aphantasia: How It Feels to Be Blind in Your Mind

#41
post #9

And now I wonder what someone with aphantasia would see using psychedelic drugs, or while meditating... Still nothing ? Could that help ?

I always suspected my internal experience was atypical, but for a long time I just chalked it up to differences in how people talk about it. I realized I was aphantasic by going to a Tibetan buddhist meditation class. It's all about visualization and a few sessions in, I was like, "Wait, do you really see these things in your mind's eye?!" The teacher/monk suggested I try visualizing a stop sign or a white square. Nothing. I sit Vipassana now.

Re: Aphantasia: How It Feels to Be Blind in Your Mind

#42
This is fascinating. I have to test every single person in my life. I know my wife already has synesthesia so I'd assume she also can conjure up images at will, but who knows. I've heard of people who have no inner monologue, but never people who have no mind's eye! I wonder how common it really is? Thanks for this article.

Re: Aphantasia: How It Feels to Be Blind in Your Mind

#43
post #24
post #9

And now I wonder what someone with aphantasia would see using psychedelic drugs, or while meditating... Still nothing ? Could that help ?

I would describe my ability to visualize as almost exactly like that in the article. I can't answer these questions directly, but I can tell you that when I am falling asleep there is a 'switch' that turns on in my brain and all of a sudden whatever I'm thinking about will appear before me in full detail, color, texture as if I were viewing an image of it. The sudden change has been enough to wake me up at times, oth…

> I can tell you that when I am falling asleep there is a 'switch' that turns on in my brain and all of a sudden whatever I'm thinking about will appear before me in full detail, color, texture as if I were viewing an image of it.

Whoa, cool. Like the author, I rarely remember any dreams (last night, total blank) and they are never visual.

Re: Aphantasia: How It Feels to Be Blind in Your Mind

#44

I would be curious to see how the HN community scores on this aphantasia survey embedded in the BBC article: http://www.bbc.com/news/health-34039054 . Perhaps there's a connection between programmers and this condition. Will you take it and report your score? The survey is oversimplified, obviously, but it was devised by the Exeter neurologists who are studying this. I got the lowest score (8/40) since none of the qu…

I get 30/40. I have very good visualisation of places and landscapes but have poor visualisation of people's face (especially relatives, it's much easier to recall the face of celebrities or people that are unknown to me or to recall imaginary people from books).

I'm also good at visualizing writing. When I was a student, during tests, I would see in my mind's eyes the place on my notes or in the book related to the question.

To go to sleep, I quickly imagine a lot of beautiful landscapes repeatedly, spending maybe a few seconds in each landscapes.

When I remember a book, I usually remember how I pictured the scenes of the book. Even 12 years after reading the dune books, I can remember the gom-jabbar pressing on Paul's neck, I can remember Alia's tapping her finger with the same rhythm as the baron Harkonnen. I can remember Siona running from the wolves.

Re: Aphantasia: How It Feels to Be Blind in Your Mind

#45

I'm the author of this post, happy to answer any questions. About me: I was formerly a director of product at FB and a founder of Firefox. My YC startup became FB's first acquisition. I'm focusing more on creative writing these days (wrote the Silicon Valley spec script and the Theranos parody that have come up on HN a few times.) Aphantasia was a pretty weird discovery for me given this new focus.

This is really quite interesting. I realise now that whilst I can visualise things, it's incredibly difficult for me. Trying to visualise a beach, for me, is seeing a flash of blue, then a flash of yellow, then they're next to each other, and that's about as far as I can get. The sky is black.

Re: Aphantasia: How It Feels to Be Blind in Your Mind

#46
post #25

> I do have the ‘milk voice’—that flat, inner monologue that has no texture or sound Sorry to tell you this, but my inner monologue does have texture and sound :P It sounds pretty close to my voice (or how I imagine my voice, I guess) and my inflections when speaking (even across languages). Even when I read other people's writings, I kinda hear myself in my mind. > However, most of my friends and family describe wha…

I think my visual imagination is quite detailed (I am a graphic designer) but I assume my aural imagination is pretty average. I can usually only imagine very basic melodies. However on many occasions, in the half sleep before waking, I have been able to aurally imagine multi layered music at a very detailed level, and it somewhat carries over for a few minutes after fully waking. I wish there was a way to tap into this during the day.

Re: Aphantasia: How It Feels to Be Blind in Your Mind

#47

I would be curious to see how the HN community scores on this aphantasia survey embedded in the BBC article: http://www.bbc.com/news/health-34039054 . Perhaps there's a connection between programmers and this condition. Will you take it and report your score? The survey is oversimplified, obviously, but it was devised by the Exeter neurologists who are studying this. I got the lowest score (8/40) since none of the qu…

I got 21 out of 40. Although it was strange - imagining a person was really hard, but imagining a sunrise / clouds / thunderstorm seemed really easy.

Even when the question was, "can you imagine their clothes" and the guy I was thinking of is well known for his, er, "drastic", clothes choices I couldn't do it. Much to my own surprise.

Re: Aphantasia: How It Feels to Be Blind in Your Mind

#48
As a child, my dad had the "Mega Memory" tapes around the house and I remember listening to them. Very early on in the lessons, the instructor talks about using basic association because we "think in pictures." As an example, he noted that if he said the word elephant, people picture an elephant, not the word "e-l-e-p-h-a-n-t." I must have been eight or nine at the time and remember being terribly confused because I couldn't really picture of an elephant in my head. I suspect I do have aphantasia to a certain degree.

Unlike the author, I do dream visually (in fact, I tend to have very vivid dreams; the most vivid ones are difficult to separate from reality, even if the subject matter is something fantastic like being part of an interstellar military or something). If I'm in a state between waking and sleeping I actually do have much more of a mind's eye, but when I'm fully awake I don't have pictures in my head...but I remember what it's like to visualize things mentally because of my dreams.

I have at least something of a "mind's ear" in that I can hear music in my head (the detail is usually not as rich; it's often just the melody with lyrics). Additionally, I have a very good memory for song lyrics and when I listen to music the concept of tuning out or not being extremely aware of the lyrics is something that friends I have described but that I rarely experience. I can usually only tune out lyrics in music if it's a song that I'm already very familiar with.

One aspect that I find interesting is that although I can't really picture places I still have spatial awareness in my mental concept of them. For example, if I remember one of the houses we lived in as a child I can "place" various objects in and around the house in their correct spatial relationships without picturing the objects themselves. Do other people with aphantasia also have this experience?

Re: Aphantasia: How It Feels to Be Blind in Your Mind

#49
post #25

> I do have the ‘milk voice’—that flat, inner monologue that has no texture or sound Sorry to tell you this, but my inner monologue does have texture and sound :P It sounds pretty close to my voice (or how I imagine my voice, I guess) and my inflections when speaking (even across languages). Even when I read other people's writings, I kinda hear myself in my mind. > However, most of my friends and family describe wha…

I've sort of developed something similar to the inner "milk voice" Blake describes in these last few years, spurred on (I think) by a bit of research into mindfulness.

One tenet? concept? component? of mindfulness is observing without judging, being fully in the moment and fully experiencing it.

The goal of (the various flavors of) mindfulness isn't to eschew emotion and become a Vulcan or anything. Emotions are great! The goal is to more fully experience our lives, including our emotions, by also being mindful observers of them...

Re: Aphantasia: How It Feels to Be Blind in Your Mind

#50
post #48

As a child, my dad had the "Mega Memory" tapes around the house and I remember listening to them. Very early on in the lessons, the instructor talks about using basic association because we "think in pictures." As an example, he noted that if he said the word elephant, people picture an elephant, not the word "e-l-e-p-h-a-n-t." I must have been eight or nine at the time and remember being terribly confused because I…

My experience is closer to yours than to the author of the original post.

1) I have a phonological loop and can easily imagine music.

2) My visuospatial sketchpad (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baddeley%27s_model_of_working_...) is almost entirely spatial. I don't know the color of the floor in my kitchen, unless I paid attention to it specifically and verbally in the past. But I can use memory palace successfully.

3) I wonder if for me it's just an undeveloped habit which could be improved: I have dreams with pictures and colors once a few months, and sometimes I see pictures when I'm half asleep, but it's really hard to put myself into that state intentionally.

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