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Why Thieves Steal Soap

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Re: Why Thieves Steal Soap

#41

Post by adrusi »

possibility wrote: post #38
adrusi wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the parent didn't want to associate a group of people with stealing, they could have just started the quote at "gangs" and it would have worked just as well... But really, any reader who doesn't already have racial prejudices will recognize that the operative word is "gangs", not "[ethnic group]". It's a bit of an insult to the sensibilities of HN readers, and it doesn't protect anyone from anything.

I agree with you, but I'm going to quibble over: > any reader who doesn't already have racial prejudices because I don't believe these people exist.

Fair. Maybe it would be better to say "any reader who recognizes their prejudices and compensates accordingly". Bit of a mouthful though.

Re: Why Thieves Steal Soap

#43

Post by possibility »

adrusi wrote: post #41
possibility wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you, but I'm going to quibble over: > any reader who doesn't already have racial prejudices because I don't believe these people exist.

Fair. Maybe it would be better to say "any reader who recognizes their prejudices and compensates accordingly". Bit of a mouthful though.

Hmmm. How about "any thoughtful reader"? Works for me.

Re: Why Thieves Steal Soap

#44

Post by randyrand »

wyattpeak wrote: post #40
gozur88 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that combating racism, or is it combating information? Is there such a thing as a racist fact?

There may be no such thing as a racist fact, but there's definitely such a thing as racist dissemination of a fact. If, for example, you post a list of facts about crime rates among a particular ethnic group apropos of nothing, it's probably racist, regardless of whether or not the facts are true. That said, in this case I think it's just the bad taste that one often gets in their mouth knowing that a racist might re…

> is there meaningful information lost here?

IMO, its not so much the loss of information, its the implication that racial problems should not be considered racial problems.

Re: Why Thieves Steal Soap

#46

Post by mitchtbaum »

dredmorbius wrote: post #26

William Stanley Jevons, Money and the Mechanism for Exchange (1876) discusses many of the characteristics of money and exchange, including in chapter V, the properties which make money useful: utility and value, portability, indestructability, homogeneity, divisibility, stabilityof value, and cognizability. The merchandise stolen for use as "street coin" as described in the article meet most or all of these character…

Wow, what an interesting book.

> stability of value

Yes, soap has phenomenal storage value! Depending on its ingredients you can keep soap bars indefinitely, and they will maintain 100% of their value. If necessary, you can (re)pack it with food storage tools to ensure it stays dry, like vacuum-sealed mylar bags in plastic bins, but as I understand it, soaponified oil won't go rancid even with moderate O2 exposure. For friends looking to save for their future, I advise putting soap near the top of their list and making a full space for it among their shelves.

For my needs, I have found this soap works and feels great: http://www.kirksnatural.com/products/kirks-fragrance-free-co...

Re: Why Thieves Steal Soap

#47

Post by possibility »

randyrand wrote: post #30
dsl wrote: post #24

The Safeway in the San Francisco Castro neighborhood is especially... exciting... relative to the surrounding area. It even has its own full time police officer. One time as I was leaving I asked the officer why Folgers crystals of all things were locked up. His reply was "[ethnic group] gangs steal essentials in bulk, and sell them to the homeless." From that point forward it clicked in my head, retail theft is abou…

> [ethnic group] interesting way to combat racism...

The irony is that the inhabitants of the "San Francisco Castro neighborhood" also form an ethnic group by virtue of living in the same place. Notably, it's a gay neighborhood. Takeaway? Gangs rob stores in gay villages. Oh, and cops are racists. Moral? Let people think for themselves, you can't get away from prejudice.

Re: Why Thieves Steal Soap

#48

Post by gozur88 »

randyrand wrote: post #37
gozur88 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that combating racism, or is it combating information? Is there such a thing as a racist fact?

If a fact shows an ethnic group in negative light, then its possible its better to ignore that fact and not speak of it. By not speaking of it, it may make the overall problem of racism go away faster. So goes the theory at least.

I don't find that theory very sound. Facts that are unspoken become "things everybody knows but can't speak of", and in a society governed by things everybody knows but can't speak of things that aren't actually true can't be refuted.

Re: Why Thieves Steal Soap

#49

Post by wyattpeak »

randyrand wrote: post #44
wyattpeak wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There may be no such thing as a racist fact, but there's definitely such a thing as racist dissemination of a fact. If, for example, you post a list of facts about crime rates among a particular ethnic group apropos of nothing, it's probably racist, regardless of whether or not the facts are true. That said, in this case I think it's just the bad taste that one often gets in their mouth knowing that a racist might re…

> is there meaningful information lost here? IMO, its not so much the loss of information, its the implication that racial problems should not be considered racial problems.

I agree it carries that implication, and I think it's right.

Very little is added to the discussion of curbing gang crime by bringing race into the picture. What are the specifically Black solutions to gang behaviour? What are the Hispanic ones?

On the other hand, the culture of racism and intolerance such discussions engender has real and measurable downsides. Cf. every discussion of police interactions by minorities.

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