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Legal marijuana is taking a bite out of drug cartels' profits

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Legal marijuana is taking a bite out of drug cartels' profits

#41
Its nice to have some data to confirm what many predicted. That said, the DEA is acutely aware that it is much easier to move drugs around once they are already in the country and so their mission my require installing border crossing checkpoints on states that have legalized those drugs.

I saw a sign on the Kansas side of a highway leaving Colorado that said "If you bought pot, leave it behind." Clearly someone had seen an uptick in drugs coming in that way.

Re: Legal marijuana is taking a bite out of drug cartels' profits

#42
post #11
post #5

The cartels, of course, are adapting to the new reality. Seizure data appears to indicate that with marijuana profits tumbling, they're switching over to heroin and meth. This is a really interesting development. There's always been this "gateway drug" argument around pot: once people start with marijuana, they'll move onto the harder stuff. I can imagine that there might be a correlation, but I expect that the causa…

Here's to hoping people realize and deal with the real gateway drug: Prescription opiates

These days it's hard to get a handful of Vicodin to get you through a few days of pain after hurting your back.

It's being "dealt with" for sure. I'm not sure the amount of inconvenience and needless suffering imposed is an improvement on anything. I've never abused drugs. Opiates after back pain, minor surgery or a root canal aren't a "gateway" to anything for the vast vast majority of people.

I don't know about recreational heroin, cocaine or meth. I'm going to err on the side of caution and suggest that they're probably something I don't want to see legalized.

OTOH it'd be nice if marijuana advocates would stop treating alcohol as if it's the worst substance known to man. Current DWI laws are not justified with science. Legalizing marijuana and criminalizing responsible consumption of alcohol is not progress. If everyone you know would probably be in jail were it not for the fact they haven't been caught, it's probably not a good law.

Sane pain management should be between you and your Dr. Ethical patient treatment should not be disincentivized because someone has a political agenda.

Re: Legal marijuana is taking a bite out of drug cartels' profits

#43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cannabis being illegal actually influences people to use prescription drugs and meth. If someone has a job that drug tests them or are on probation, then people will choose harder drugs (or alcohol). The only drug aside from PCP that stays in your system over 3 days is cannabis.

Interestingly, in Colorado it's legal for a company to fire an employee who has (legally) smoked marijuana. So even with legalization drug tests may remain a thing.

It's interesting, but taken through some lenses, maybe that's still OK?

I've never smoked, but I wonder if I'd like my doctor to be high when he operates on me, or for an armorer to reassemble my rifle while high. Does marijuana influence attention to detail? Is there a way to ensure that people don't get high while at work, that they stay sober on the job? Anecdotally, from watching high people while I was in university, I don't think I'd trust their giggling selves with my life.

Re: Legal marijuana is taking a bite out of drug cartels' profits

#44
post #9
post #2

This is one of the main reasons I support legalization and/or decriminalization of all drugs. Demand is demand, and a black market economy is worse than a transparent & regulated economy. I think it's still necessary to focus on reducing demand (through education and self-help, not punishment).

>Demand is demand, and a black market economy is worse than a transparent & regulated economy. would this apply to gun ownership too?

In WA and CO (and others) cannabis is more regulated than guns.

Re: Legal marijuana is taking a bite out of drug cartels' profits

#45
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interestingly, in Colorado it's legal for a company to fire an employee who has (legally) smoked marijuana. So even with legalization drug tests may remain a thing.

It's interesting, but taken through some lenses, maybe that's still OK? I've never smoked, but I wonder if I'd like my doctor to be high when he operates on me, or for an armorer to reassemble my rifle while high. Does marijuana influence attention to detail? Is there a way to ensure that people don't get high while at work, that they stay sober on the job? Anecdotally, from watching high people while I was in univer…

There are plenty of legal substances that you don't want you doctor to be on, before he operates on you.

Re: Legal marijuana is taking a bite out of drug cartels' profits

#46
post #35
post #2

This is one of the main reasons I support legalization and/or decriminalization of all drugs. Demand is demand, and a black market economy is worse than a transparent & regulated economy. I think it's still necessary to focus on reducing demand (through education and self-help, not punishment).

I'm of the opinion people should be able to do what they want. And certainly drugs being illegal causes more problems than it solves. That being said, here is a case to think about. When I was in my early 20's (20 years ago) I got a job in Phoenix AZ working on a concrete crew. We were building poured in place buildings (something like big box store size). First we would pour the floor. Then the walls on top of the f…

If I can try to paraphrase: Criminalization has been so ineffective that you were simply expected to use meth at this one job you had, because everyone else was doing it.

And you think this might argue in favor of continued criminalization?

Re: Legal marijuana is taking a bite out of drug cartels' profits

#47
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interestingly, in Colorado it's legal for a company to fire an employee who has (legally) smoked marijuana. So even with legalization drug tests may remain a thing.

It's interesting, but taken through some lenses, maybe that's still OK? I've never smoked, but I wonder if I'd like my doctor to be high when he operates on me, or for an armorer to reassemble my rifle while high. Does marijuana influence attention to detail? Is there a way to ensure that people don't get high while at work, that they stay sober on the job? Anecdotally, from watching high people while I was in univer…

Do you also refuse to trust people that drank a glass of wine with their dinner several weeks ago?

Re: Legal marijuana is taking a bite out of drug cartels' profits

#48
post #46
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm of the opinion people should be able to do what they want. And certainly drugs being illegal causes more problems than it solves. That being said, here is a case to think about. When I was in my early 20's (20 years ago) I got a job in Phoenix AZ working on a concrete crew. We were building poured in place buildings (something like big box store size). First we would pour the floor. Then the walls on top of the f…

If I can try to paraphrase: Criminalization has been so ineffective that you were simply expected to use meth at this one job you had, because everyone else was doing it. And you think this might argue in favor of continued criminalization?

This was one anecdote. I have another anecdote where I was not expected to do meth. Can we turn your argument around now?

Re: Legal marijuana is taking a bite out of drug cartels' profits

#49
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's interesting, but taken through some lenses, maybe that's still OK? I've never smoked, but I wonder if I'd like my doctor to be high when he operates on me, or for an armorer to reassemble my rifle while high. Does marijuana influence attention to detail? Is there a way to ensure that people don't get high while at work, that they stay sober on the job? Anecdotally, from watching high people while I was in univer…

Do you also refuse to trust people that drank a glass of wine with their dinner several weeks ago?

That would be absurd for someone to do, but, if someone wants to, well, freedom of association?

Note: I am not strongly committed to this idea I am expressing at the time of this writing. I'm not even sure I am at all committed to it. I do think its a relevant position that seems worth considering, if nothing else.

Re: Legal marijuana is taking a bite out of drug cartels' profits

#50
post #46
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm of the opinion people should be able to do what they want. And certainly drugs being illegal causes more problems than it solves. That being said, here is a case to think about. When I was in my early 20's (20 years ago) I got a job in Phoenix AZ working on a concrete crew. We were building poured in place buildings (something like big box store size). First we would pour the floor. Then the walls on top of the f…

If I can try to paraphrase: Criminalization has been so ineffective that you were simply expected to use meth at this one job you had, because everyone else was doing it. And you think this might argue in favor of continued criminalization?

No, not at all. I agree... this kind of problem exists even with criminalization and I agree on the pretty obvious (to me anyway) need to do away with criminalization.

But problems of this kind could become worse if taking meth were legal. That's my only point.

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