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TPP banning requirements to transfer or access to source code of software

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41–50 of 162 posts

Re: TPP banning requirements to transfer or access to source code of software

#41
post #34
post #5

Would this prevent us from requiring VW make available it's source code? Not a lawyer.

Why would you want VW to make available its source code?

I believe the implication is that, if they were forced to release their source then either:

a) they would have been less likely to deliberately subvert the emissions tests in the code or

b) they were more likely to have been found out earlier.

Re: TPP banning requirements to transfer or access to source code of software

#42
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Playing the devil's advocate here, but you shouldn't need access to a car's source code to measure its emissions. The test is broken, not the software.

Expounding further - what government agency has the time or money to actually sift through mountains of source code? From a pure financial standpoint, there's no possible way that it isn't cheaper to just measure real emissions than attempt some kind of software analysis for every version of every vehicle on the market. Furthermore, an agency inspecting source code has absolutely no way to tell whether or not that th…

You not only have to sift through the code, but compile and flash it yourself.

Re: TPP banning requirements to transfer or access to source code of software

#43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>This prevents a country from forcing somebody like Microsoft or Apple to give up their source code for "inspection" in order to access their market. Since when is that a good thing?

America hopes to use TPP as a model for a similar deal with China, so America has insisted on a bunch of rules you'd only expect in a trade deal with a banana republic - like investor-state dispute settlement. At present, "Chinese officials have learned to tackle multinational companies, often forcing them to form joint ventures with [Chinese companies] and transfer the latest technology in exchange for current and f…

The TPP is actually supposed to exclude China and create a competing trade bloc. It was even called the "everybody but China deal" by some people. All part of Obama's "pivot to Asia"... supposedly.

However, given the contents of the treaty, I don't think this exclusion is something that really bothers China.

China wanted in on the WTO bad. Real bad. China doesn't really care about the TPP.

Re: TPP banning requirements to transfer or access to source code of software

#45
post #4

These are rules for States. It has no bearing whatsoever on the GPL. This prevents a country from forcing somebody like Microsoft or Apple to give up their source code for "inspection" in order to access their market. It also helps to prevent States from demanding and acquiring encryption or other private keys (there's a separate section that also explicitly forbids mandating backdoors be added). Not everything in th…

Maybe not everything in it is bad, but this part is very bad.

It means other countries can not have the software they buy inspected for NSA (or whoever else) planted backdoors.

It also means that countries can not ask for source code in a guarantee that the software will remain useful if the company goes away.

What it does not mean is that those countries will stop pirating software. There's no mechanism for enforcing that.

Re: TPP banning requirements to transfer or access to source code of software

#46
post #4

These are rules for States. It has no bearing whatsoever on the GPL. This prevents a country from forcing somebody like Microsoft or Apple to give up their source code for "inspection" in order to access their market. It also helps to prevent States from demanding and acquiring encryption or other private keys (there's a separate section that also explicitly forbids mandating backdoors be added). Not everything in th…

Maybe not everything in it is bad, but this part is very bad. It means other countries can not have the software they buy inspected for NSA (or whoever else) planted backdoors. It also means that countries can not ask for source code in a guarantee that the software will remain useful if the company goes away. What it does not mean is that those countries will stop pirating software. There's no mechanism for enforcin…

They can still do both of those things, they just can't stop the import of software that has not been inspected or had the source shared.

So a government can still choose to use open source software, and have whoever do whatever consulting on that software, they just can't refuse to allow a proprietary vendor to offer their product for sale.

Re: TPP banning requirements to transfer or access to source code of software

#47
post #4

These are rules for States. It has no bearing whatsoever on the GPL. This prevents a country from forcing somebody like Microsoft or Apple to give up their source code for "inspection" in order to access their market. It also helps to prevent States from demanding and acquiring encryption or other private keys (there's a separate section that also explicitly forbids mandating backdoors be added). Not everything in th…

Maybe not everything in it is bad, but this part is very bad. It means other countries can not have the software they buy inspected for NSA (or whoever else) planted backdoors. It also means that countries can not ask for source code in a guarantee that the software will remain useful if the company goes away. What it does not mean is that those countries will stop pirating software. There's no mechanism for enforcin…

[deleted]

Re: TPP banning requirements to transfer or access to source code of software

#48
post #4

These are rules for States. It has no bearing whatsoever on the GPL. This prevents a country from forcing somebody like Microsoft or Apple to give up their source code for "inspection" in order to access their market. It also helps to prevent States from demanding and acquiring encryption or other private keys (there's a separate section that also explicitly forbids mandating backdoors be added). Not everything in th…

[deleted]

Re: TPP banning requirements to transfer or access to source code of software

#49
Actually this should (and I believe some day will) be mandatory. Everyone who wants to take money for software should be obliged to disclose full source code to purchaser. In case of mass market software it would be just publishing the source code.

As products grow in complexity and corporation grow in power the only way to secure safety of the public would be to prevent corporations from profiting from secrecy.

Re: TPP banning requirements to transfer or access to source code of software

#50
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Playing the devil's advocate here, but you shouldn't need access to a car's source code to measure its emissions. The test is broken, not the software.

Expounding further - what government agency has the time or money to actually sift through mountains of source code? From a pure financial standpoint, there's no possible way that it isn't cheaper to just measure real emissions than attempt some kind of software analysis for every version of every vehicle on the market. Furthermore, an agency inspecting source code has absolutely no way to tell whether or not that th…

If you have source code then you can tell whether a particular executable was built from said source code. Pull the executable out of the car and also build the source code yourself as instructed by the manufacturer, compare the two binaries.

If the binaries don't match, then whatever certification the device needs automatically fails and it cannot be sold.

What that means is that later on, if "Something Bad" happens, you are in a position to be certain of what code was running. This makes investigation much easier as there is no chance that the original source code cannot be found when needed later. This does get a bit more complicated with software updates, especially OTA updates.

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