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Haskell for Mac

haskellformac.com

41–50 of 185 posts

Re: Haskell for Mac

#41

A programming language implementation that is subject to sandboxing? Mac has become the parody of a computer.

Everything is subject to sandboxing if it wants to sell through the Mac App Store. He could also just not do that, and have none of those limitations.

Re: Haskell for Mac

#42
post #29

Why do we still have platform-specific applications in 2015? Any good software engineering environment should set an example and show that we do not need to live by such artificial restrictions.

Those 'artificial' restrictions are as natural as they can get. Different operating systems have different Shells and APIs, even programming languages. Nothing artificial in there.

Re: Haskell for Mac

#43
post #35
post #28

As required by the Mac App Store, Haskell for Mac is sandboxed. Consequently, Haskell code executed in a Haskell for Mac playground cannot access any data except for Haskell for Mac documents, the app container, and those system files white-listed by the operating system. Any attempt to access other files or to initiate a network connection will be rejected by the operating system. This seems unnecessarily crippling.…

Yes, it’s required. Only some apps are exempt from sandboxing because they existed before sandboxing was introduced. You can also reach out of the sandbox through some user actions, for example opening a file using the system file picker gives you permissions to access this file. Yes, it’s a big constraint. For some apps it’s a show-stopper. As user I mostly welcome it because of the additional protection it gets me.

Apart from that it doesn't get you any additional protection whatsoever. With all the root OS X exploits floating around that bust you out of the sandbox as well as giving you full system access, as someone that has several utilities on the Mac App Store, it would be trivial to put an app there that gets set off by a timer, exploits root, and wreaks havoc.

Source: https://www.google.com/search?q=os+x+root+exploit&gws_rd=ssl

Re: Haskell for Mac

#44
post #43
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it’s required. Only some apps are exempt from sandboxing because they existed before sandboxing was introduced. You can also reach out of the sandbox through some user actions, for example opening a file using the system file picker gives you permissions to access this file. Yes, it’s a big constraint. For some apps it’s a show-stopper. As user I mostly welcome it because of the additional protection it gets me.

Apart from that it doesn't get you any additional protection whatsoever. With all the root OS X exploits floating around that bust you out of the sandbox as well as giving you full system access, as someone that has several utilities on the Mac App Store, it would be trivial to put an app there that gets set off by a timer, exploits root, and wreaks havoc. Source: https://www.google.com/search?q=os+x+root+exploit&gws…

Hence https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System_Integrity_Protection

Re: Haskell for Mac

#45
post #43
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it’s required. Only some apps are exempt from sandboxing because they existed before sandboxing was introduced. You can also reach out of the sandbox through some user actions, for example opening a file using the system file picker gives you permissions to access this file. Yes, it’s a big constraint. For some apps it’s a show-stopper. As user I mostly welcome it because of the additional protection it gets me.

Apart from that it doesn't get you any additional protection whatsoever. With all the root OS X exploits floating around that bust you out of the sandbox as well as giving you full system access, as someone that has several utilities on the Mac App Store, it would be trivial to put an app there that gets set off by a timer, exploits root, and wreaks havoc. Source: https://www.google.com/search?q=os+x+root+exploit&gws…

I mean I can easily install an app to try it out, then uninstall and be reasonably sure it’s completely gone, without changing the rest of the system by incompetence or ignorance. That’s still pretty good. If the developer wants to harm you intentionally, that’s tough game on any system.

Re: Haskell for Mac

#46
post #36
post #29

Why do we still have platform-specific applications in 2015? Any good software engineering environment should set an example and show that we do not need to live by such artificial restrictions.

Because there’s no environment that would give you native-like experience on multiple platforms without extra work. And developers have limited resources, even in 2015.

Although it is possible to write everything, right up to the view model (but not the view) in something cross platform and performant, keeping the GUI/view using only those languages/frameworks which result in native feel (both in terms of look and performance).

Sure, writing the GUI properly for each platform still requires more work, but far far less if all but the front end is cross platform.

However, it very rarely seems to be done, even with modern additions and improvements in C++.

Re: Haskell for Mac

#47
post #36
post #29

Why do we still have platform-specific applications in 2015? Any good software engineering environment should set an example and show that we do not need to live by such artificial restrictions.

Because there’s no environment that would give you native-like experience on multiple platforms without extra work. And developers have limited resources, even in 2015.

[deleted]

Re: Haskell for Mac

#48
post #29

Why do we still have platform-specific applications in 2015? Any good software engineering environment should set an example and show that we do not need to live by such artificial restrictions.

In my experience cross-platform means "runs just as badly everywhere". They pretty much never feel like native on any platform.

And what's the advantage to the average user? If I'm a Mac user, I'm interested in Application X working just like every other Mac application. Similarly if I'm a Windows user. I'm rarely bothered that Application X works the same on both Windows and Mac.

Re: Haskell for Mac

#49
post #28

As required by the Mac App Store, Haskell for Mac is sandboxed. Consequently, Haskell code executed in a Haskell for Mac playground cannot access any data except for Haskell for Mac documents, the app container, and those system files white-listed by the operating system. Any attempt to access other files or to initiate a network connection will be rejected by the operating system. This seems unnecessarily crippling.…

Exhibit A for how questionable this Sandboxing is when it comes to things like programming languages. And exhibit A for how Mac is becoming a household appliance instead of a general-purpose computer that YOU own and do with what YOU want. If you want to own your Mac you need to stay away from the AppStore at the very least, and ideally build all your shit yourself.

Its not required to install apps through the MAS.

Re: Haskell for Mac

#50
I bought it. If someone (cough)Jetbrains were to offer a full blown IDE with code-navigation, refactoring tools, smart autocomplete etc etc. I would pay them 10 times as much.
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