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Ask HN: Who here would be interested in a free daily updated GeoIP database?

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Re: Ask HN: Who here would be interested in a free daily updated GeoIP database?

#41

Post by lucb1e »

I use GeoIP fairly regularly. How I would set this up:

- Free version: only updated once [every 6 months / a year] and non-commercial use only

- Paid version: $9.99 for a year of free updates

- Updates come both in diff and in full version (for the commercial version)

- Use a common format, or use multiple formats. People love csv, but more serious applications probably use an existing format (I see maxmind a lot in this thread).

- Perhaps an API with heavy ratelimiting for people who need only a very occasional lookup (for very occasional use, I use ip2location.com/demo currently; for more serious stuff I download a database).

Having a free version with a nice license might also get you included in a lot of open source software, which increases name visibility and makes people write parsers for your format of choice.

A minor note on payment: accept Paypal and/or Bitcoin, or I (and many other Europeans) can never pay you. These credit card-only services are impossible to order from.

Idea for the diff: if you have a binary format, perhaps use this: https://www.chromium.org/developers/design-documents/softwar...

Re: Ask HN: Who here would be interested in a free daily updated GeoIP database?

#42

Post by lucb1e »

bisdata wrote: post #34

On a related note, would anyone in the community be interested in an inexpensive service that differentiates dynamic from static IPs? Dynamic IPs would be accompanied by an estimate of lease duration.

I wouldn't want this to exist because it discriminates my dynamic-looking IP address from server IP addresses (even though mine is statically assigned to my Internet subscription) and I have enough trouble hosting things at home already.

But I understand that's not really an argument: you might say you don't want nukes to exist because they hurt people. I just wanted to mention it.

That said, maybe. Usually an rdns lookup does the trick already though (a4-8e-ef-78.dynamic.ziggo.nl or cpe-12-34-56-78.rr.com or 80-100-131-150.adsl.xs4all.nl is clear enough).

Re: Ask HN: Who here would be interested in a free daily updated GeoIP database?

#43

Post by vardars »

clouserw wrote: post #38

Mozilla runs an open/free geolocation service: https://location.services.mozilla.com/

https://mozilla-ichnaea.readthedocs.org/en/latest/config.htm... "The geoip section contains settings related to the maxmind GeoIP database." If I don't get it wrong, this service relies on MaxMind's db for GeoIP.

Re: Ask HN: Who here would be interested in a free daily updated GeoIP database?

#44

Post by rebelde »

mike-cardwell wrote: post #17
rebelde wrote: post #5

I have long thought that we could do better than maxmind. I have a website with tens of millions of users all over the world that could help you build this database is your want to lead the effort. I imagine showing users what country we think they are in and they correct it if it is wrong.

I imagine browser language settings would be a useful indicator too. Not perfect obviously, but highly useful given enough data.

That, too. We could use a number of different indicators to help figure it out.

Re: Ask HN: Who here would be interested in a free daily updated GeoIP database?

#45

Post by _delirium »

PythonicAlpha wrote: post #36
_delirium wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You almost certainly don't want to be using IP geolocation to compute sales tax, rather some kind of billing address explicitly provided by the customer.

In that case, the customer could cheat. I am not totally sure about the current discussion on that, but the problem is, that you definitively can not rely on the address given of the customer, because in this case the customer will always give a country with the lowest sales tax. Also you must provide proofs for the location. The IP address is IMHO (and not only my opinion) better and will be more likely be recognize…

In Denmark, at least, billing address is standard for non-physical goods as well. It's validated via the payment method, typically credit card or bank transfer. It's possible to cheat this, too, but harder than just making up a fake address. Afaik none of the main online sellers in DK are relying on IP address currently, in part because accuracy is not good enough, and in part because people traveling across borders is common (many residents of Malmö, for example, have Danish IP addresses during the day and Swedish IP addresses at night).

Re: Ask HN: Who here would be interested in a free daily updated GeoIP database?

#46

Post by JoshGlazebrook »

lucb1e wrote: post #41

I use GeoIP fairly regularly. How I would set this up: - Free version: only updated once [every 6 months / a year] and non-commercial use only - Paid version: $9.99 for a year of free updates - Updates come both in diff and in full version (for the commercial version) - Use a common format, or use multiple formats. People love csv, but more serious applications probably use an existing format (I see maxmind a lot in…

I actually use ip2location's demo page as well. I put together my own api that grabs ip to location data from the 4-5 sources that provide the information for free, and then look for similarities. So if a (city, region, country) is present 3/5 times, it defaults to that. If they're not any similarities, it will default to maxmind geoip2's demo (if it hasn't already used up the daily free lookups). And then cache it all of course. Works well for the limited amount of lookups I need.

Re: Ask HN: Who here would be interested in a free daily updated GeoIP database?

#47

Post by rebelde »

notatoad wrote: post #25
karmajunkie wrote: post #19

I'll echo the "low cost, not free" thought. Stuff takes money to maintain. I don't want to build a service that depends on an unsustainable business model.

Maxmind is low cost, not free, and has a pretty good track record. What would you want from an alternative?

I would want: - Easier updates. Now it is a minor hassle to update my MySQL database table from CVS. I need to do it again soon. - Availability in different formats. For my personal needs, I would love to download a MySQL MyISAM table. - More accurate data, including "ambiguous country" for employees of multinational firms. - Related open source tools through github.

Re: Ask HN: Who here would be interested in a free daily updated GeoIP database?

#48

Post by PythonicAlpha »

_delirium wrote: post #45
PythonicAlpha wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In that case, the customer could cheat. I am not totally sure about the current discussion on that, but the problem is, that you definitively can not rely on the address given of the customer, because in this case the customer will always give a country with the lowest sales tax. Also you must provide proofs for the location. The IP address is IMHO (and not only my opinion) better and will be more likely be recognize…

In Denmark, at least, billing address is standard for non-physical goods as well. It's validated via the payment method, typically credit card or bank transfer. It's possible to cheat this, too, but harder than just making up a fake address. Afaik none of the main online sellers in DK are relying on IP address currently, in part because accuracy is not good enough, and in part because people traveling across borders…

You can not validate all payment methods by country (or do you want to limit the methods provided?). Also nobody hinders you from creating a bank account in a different EU country.

That "all" are doing it, does not guarantee, that one time a judge or tax controller will come and argue with you that you have no proofs at all. In this case, you are really bust, because the new law also says, that you are accountable for the tax to all the countries tax authorities. Much fun, when you get citations from different EU countries.

(Don't say it is not realistic: There are cases already public, where British shops got claims from remote EU countries, because of tax differences of And as long the EU does provide laws that are hard to implement in real life (only in the minds of the politicians they are simple) and nobody says how to implement them, it is better to collect all proof you can get.

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