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Tesla is committing automotive suicide

electrek.co

391–400 of 458 posts

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#391
post #355
post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is knowing which lane keeping assist systems are good and which are not. Every dealer just treats it as a 'checkbox' item and implementations vary by model and year. Had a Kia loaner a few years back that to my surprise tried to actively kill me by repeatedly steering into oncoming traffic on a provincial road. I really prefer steering myself to last-second correcting a temperamental computer.

There's no way in hell I'd buy a car nowadays without at least a weekend rental. There's too many random dumb features. (Hyundai/Kia's coffee break notification?)

Pretty much all the manufacturers have that now. I'm skeptical that it works, but it definitely tackles a real problem with drowsy drivers.

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#392
This story may be true. But I have read Fred Lanbert articles on Tesla and they are always negative. And in many cases even biased. So I'd take it with a pinch of salt.

It's not like Tesla is failing, they have $40 billion cash at hand, more than many auto company's net worth,it's that people want to believe that Tesla is failing. I hope Tesla succeeds, with or without Musk.

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not asking for a parts list, I'm asking for math

if you want some math beyond identifying different scaling issues, go for it.

I have. That's why I'm certain you're wrong. But if you're too lazy to do it yourself there's plenty of papers written on this stuff

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#394
post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is knowing which lane keeping assist systems are good and which are not. Every dealer just treats it as a 'checkbox' item and implementations vary by model and year. Had a Kia loaner a few years back that to my surprise tried to actively kill me by repeatedly steering into oncoming traffic on a provincial road. I really prefer steering myself to last-second correcting a temperamental computer.

> The problem is knowing which lane keeping assist systems are good and which are not. Every dealer just treats it as a 'checkbox' item and implementations vary by model and year. Yep, I agree. I used to travel to my parent's home 300km away once a month, and changing from a 2010 no-assist car to a Tesla Model 3 with AP (not FSD) back in 2019 was a game changer. I used to drive there on a Friday evening after work, a…

I was driving until not long ago a VW with all those systems and, while less pleasant than the current Audi, I never met any of those inconveniences you met. Yes I know sample size, but... So, lane assist had zero visuals involved - activated or not activated, and giving your wheel a soft bump in that direction (it never tried hard turns, for better or for worse). The downside is that construction sites with colorful lines would indeed confuse it, so you'd either press the disable button, or keep your hands on the wheel (wife complained about it, but for me it was acceptable). The Audi handles construction sites perfectly, so far (soon a year). Speed limits meant on both cars only a visual some place, so you could ignore it (Audi highlights on the HUD the speed limit). So all in all, I believe Hyundai f'up it big time, or something got really wrong in that car - a perfectly good reason to give it up either way.

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#395

BYD is slapping the EV industry around like a gorilla, Tesla simply cannot compete in any meaningful way. Waymo has achieved profit per unit and people are happy to see driver-less taxis in their city and pay for the service. Tesla also cannot justify valuations based on automotive sales/subscriptions alone - they were always going to have to pivot. They're in a tight spot and they need to do something drastic.

I was in the market for an EV due to great tax advantages. I assumed BYD would be the sweet spot, but test drove a Tesla for comparison. I ended up with the Tesla. It is hands down the better vehicle and I'd be very surprised if anybody seriously thought otherwise. There wasn't very much in it price wise so that wasn't a factor. The BYD (Sealion 7) wasn't even a bad car. It's a good car. But it's inspired and just a…

Funny that you say the BYD was tasteless. I definitely agree, and it's something that can be said about much Chinese-made stuff.

In French we have the word "chinoiserie" which is used to describe objects with a certain aesthetic, reminiscent of Chinese art. It is used derogatively to mean something lacks taste even if it looks sophisticated at first sight.

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, digging tunnels is a lot harder than expected and there have been no big technical leaps to change that. The idea is great, but only if the cost goes down and digging speed goes up by a lot. I assume you got a cut of the $23bn my state took with the promise of a high-speed rail, which afaik is the only "viable(?!)" transportation project that could have been affected by this, or you just hate subways/subterranean…

The idea isn’t great, tunnels for cars or pods have really low throughput (low occupancy + safety margin headways, even at a high speed). And it hinged on them magically revolutionising an already highly mature field, which surprise, surprise didn’t work out. If it had been possible to speed up and reduce the cost of tunneling, the thing that would most make sense is running regular trains through them. But they neve…

I disagree, tunnels for transport of both people and goods, especially in high-density urban areas is the best way to go. Walking and biking is great for their distance, but cars and trucks are still needed for larger and heavier items. Using shared transportation (like a train) is terrible for "The last mile". Doing everything at night just seems like a band-aid and sucks for all those workers.

The idea of trying to solve the hard infrastructure problem of digging first also seems like a great idea. Build the aqueduct before you build the millions of houses and farms, and even let anyone do that part.

It's still premature to say that they haven't revolutionized the field, people around the world are still digging tunnels so there's still a market. It wouldn't be the first time an already highly mature field got revolutionized, I still don't get why you're so anti-tunnel.

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My brother bought a Tesla recently. They dicked him around with delivery, and he had to pay a ton to get charging infrastructure installed at his house, but it's fast so he's happy. On a recent visit, he finally showed me the car, and it was hilarious how janky the final product is. Everything seems cobbled together-- a good example is that there's apparently two separate voice assistants (plus his phone) and none of…

I have a 2022 Model 3, and the hilariously tragic part is that the voice assistant was great and basically never gave me any problems until they shoved Grok into it, whereupon it broke completely. I never use it anymore, they effectively removed a feature from my car.

Do a quick press of the voice button and the old voice control activate; if you hold it down or press too long, it uses the grok AI which can't do anything (and I never use).

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#398
post #127

I have a Model Y with AI hardware version 4. It is phenomenal at self-driving, and if your impression of FSD is a year old or older, then you are woefully out of date in understanding where the tech is today. If I could, I would send my own grade school child off to her friend's houses and extracurricular activities in my car unaccompanied. It is safer than buses, taxis, and me. Not since Tesla created the first econ…

Would you say it's better/safer than Waymo?

Re: Tesla is committing automotive suicide

#400
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consumer robotics strikes me as an engineering tar pit so deep it leads to hell. If full self driving is hard due to the long tail of unusual special cases, this is orders of magnitude worse. Take FSD but multiply the number of actuators and degrees of freedom by at least 10, more like 100. Add a third dimension. Add direct physical interaction with complex objects. Add pets and children. Add toys on the floor. Add r…

Also, how will these robots make money? They are a less capable human. Humans who aren't skilled don't make much money.

They’ll be bought/leased, providing direct profit. Also, there’ll be maintenance revenue. I think they’re expected to cost around $30K.

In the case where they’re replacing a low-skill human worker, they’ll pay for themselves in 1-2 years…plus no sick days, no drug use, no theft, and they can work 24 hours a day, less any recharging time.

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