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Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

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Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#391

Post by Kuinox »

jdashg wrote: post #337
Kuinox wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you played in this era ? - If you were too good on some server, you'd get banned. - If the admin doesn't know well cheating, he could tolerate something that was obvious cheating. - Cheaters could just change server often. It used to be easy to just ban peoples yes, and it was as easy to switch servers. Plus on most competitive game today, you have custom lobbies, which do exactly what you want, and there is a re…

I did indeed play in the era LanceH is talking about, and I agree with them! We had many thriving communities with no serious cheating problems because of community moderation. Yes, there were poorly moderated servers, but you could simply leave and try a different community until you found one that clicked for you. When you require equal moderation everywhere, you throw the baby out with the bath water.

How much time did you wasted server hopping ?

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#392

Post by Pulcinella »

MrDrMcCoy wrote: post #201
Q6T46nT668w6i3m wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was in a similar situation and ended up buying a PS5. It ended up being exactly what I wanted.

How's the mouse and keyboard story on PlayStation? The few shooters I play would greatly hinder me if I were stuck on a gamepad.

PS5 completely supports mouse and keyboard at a hardware level. It's up to the game though if they support it. The new Doom games don't support it on console even though M&KB are obviously supported on Windows for example. Other games do like the Quake 1 & 2 remasters. I think even Monster Hunter Wilds does if you really want to.

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#393

Post by 999900000999 »

krelian wrote: post #303
Mindwipe wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does mean that a signed OS image is running, so demonstrates that the kernel was unaltered at start-up. It also demonstrates further levels of driver signing robustness.

I'm not really familiar with Secure Boot too much. Researching suggests that users can add their own keys so they are trusted by UEFI. Won't this resolve for linux users that must have secure boot on?

It's usually a giant pia.

Some distros support it, some make it really difficult.

I like to distro hop. I'll often have to try two or three to get to a working system.

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#395

Post by ThatPlayer »

simoncion wrote: post #375
jadbox wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What? Helldivers 2 works just fine on linux for me. Is this just a windows thing?

Not all anticheat fails to work in Wine/Proton. The super invasive kernel-mode variants (that is, the sort that's in Valorant) flat out fail, and surely always will. It's my (perhaps mistaken) understanding that with some others (like Easy Anti Cheat), it's a choice made by the game dev as to whether running in Wine/Proton will be permitted or not.

That's not exclusive to kernel-mode anti-cheats. Even VAC, which is not kernel-mode, doesn't work in Proton: https://github.com/ValveSoftware/Proton/issues/3225

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#396

Post by autoexec »

LanceH wrote: post #277
LMYahooTFY wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't the reason. The reason it's necessary is because players want to be able to play with/against other players around the world. Matchmaking requires some form of anti-cheat. Running your own server as admin can't give you the degree of competitive global ranking that players enjoy today. And cheating is an arms race. It's just hacking. You either preserve game integrity or you're going to have cheaters.

We lost a lot of other things as well. Like modding and especially maps. It doesn't matter how good the game developers are, someone out there is could make a better map. The studios took control of everything, and their answer is to rootkit our computers, and to buy more DLC if we want another map. Personally, I don't accept the premise that such studio control is necessary for me to have fun playing a game. I espec…

This is the truth of it. If you can unlock all the on-disc DLC or create and use your own maps, mods, skins, etc. it risks the money companies want to take from you after you've already paid the $60-$80 for the incomplete game itself.

Anti-cheat is about protecting DLC profits as much as it is anything else.

It's a shame too because we got so much good content from random people who just loved the games and wanted to create neat things for them. It was one way that some people started their careers in the video game industry and it spawned a lot of other websites and communities around sharing, reviewing, and creating all that free content.

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#397

Post by Thaxll »

bangaladore wrote: post #299
Thaxll wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not how it works, most games that take cheating seriously already have a gameserver where most of the gameplay logic happen. Doing everything server side does prevent cheating.

> Doing everything server side does prevent cheating. No. Server side only protects against some types of cheats, such as telling the server that your bullet in an FPS is actually a grenade. It cannot prevent snapping your aim to a target on screen.

I missed a *not

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#398

Post by autoexec »

pnw wrote: post #329
LanceH wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We lost a lot of other things as well. Like modding and especially maps. It doesn't matter how good the game developers are, someone out there is could make a better map. The studios took control of everything, and their answer is to rootkit our computers, and to buy more DLC if we want another map. Personally, I don't accept the premise that such studio control is necessary for me to have fun playing a game. I espec…

There are hundreds of popular games with mod support. See https://mod.io/g If anything, we are in a golden age of mods!

Not really. A huge number of players are on consoles that have little to no support for mods and games today have too many centralized online servers and companies who keep insisting on control over your local PC which means that game companies can decide what mods you can and cannot have on your system.

There was a time when the concept of "banned mods" only ever applied to a specific server out of countless other servers and locally you could do anything you wanted, even run your own server.

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#399

Post by simoncion »

ThatPlayer wrote: post #395
simoncion wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not all anticheat fails to work in Wine/Proton. The super invasive kernel-mode variants (that is, the sort that's in Valorant) flat out fail, and surely always will. It's my (perhaps mistaken) understanding that with some others (like Easy Anti Cheat), it's a choice made by the game dev as to whether running in Wine/Proton will be permitted or not.

That's not exclusive to kernel-mode anti-cheats. Even VAC, which is not kernel-mode, doesn't work in Proton: https://github.com/ValveSoftware/Proton/issues/3225

> That's not exclusive to kernel-mode anti-cheats.

Sure, I didn't intend to suggest that it was. That's one of the reasons I mentioned EAC. Apologies for the confusion.

Re: Games using anti-cheats and their compatibility with GNU/Linux or Wine/Proton

#400

Post by salawat »

LMYahooTFY wrote: post #235
LanceH wrote: post #151

Amongst the discussion of rootkits and anti-cheat, I would like to add that part of the reason it is necessary is caused by the game companies that took away the standard method of playing multiplayer -- players running their own servers. It used to be pretty easy to just ban people from playing, now we're 100% reliant on their ability to do it. So we have anti-cheat which roots our computer, and still doesn't 100% s…

This isn't the reason. The reason it's necessary is because players want to be able to play with/against other players around the world. Matchmaking requires some form of anti-cheat. Running your own server as admin can't give you the degree of competitive global ranking that players enjoy today. And cheating is an arms race. It's just hacking. You either preserve game integrity or you're going to have cheaters.

Matchmaking isn't worth rooting my machine. Give me a dedicated server to host for folks, and we'll work out an equilibrium eventually.
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