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Elon Musk's Demolition Crew

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391–400 of 411 posts

Re: Elon Musk's Demolition Crew

#391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the issue is Congress enacting a slush fund and then getting mad that the executive is treating it as such. Congress does have the authority to direct spending, but doesn’t always do so. Here’s an example appropriation for USAID: > development assistance > For necessary expenses to carry out the provisions of sections 103, 105, 106, 214, and sections 251 through 255, and chapter 10 of part I of the Foreign As…

It could choose to direct the same billion to DOE, or FCC instead and end up with very different outcomes. Let's assume it is all one giant slushfund for the executive. What now enables checks on the slush funds use? If Congress says "here's 10 billion to spend on X and Y but not on Z. And the executive says "nah, I'm going to actually not spend it on X, but Y and Z sure." So Congress says "ok here's half as much so…

To be clear, I don’t think the executive can just ignore the difference between a billion to the FCC versus a billion to USAID.

My point is that, having given a large slush fund to USAID with only vague guidance on how to spend it, they’ve put the ball in the President’s court. The President isn’t obligated to spend the money on the priorities career USAID people want to spend it on. He can spend it on whatever smart lawyers can justify as being within the broad terms of the corresponding appropriation bills. Congress never specifically appropriated money for grants to bankroll left wing labor organizations in Bangladesh. The executive did that and the executive can undo that. And they can see where they stand in terms of total program funding after all that’s done.

And it’ll take time to see whether he’s going to end up spending less than appropriated for statutory programs, such that there’s an impoundment. Remember, USAID isn’t going away, it’s keeping 600 or so mission critical employees.

Re: Elon Musk's Demolition Crew

#392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about: any democracy where Elon Musk (an unelected, private citizen) isn't granted unfettered access to dismantle the federal government.

[flagged]

> Musk at least is an agent of the guy who just won the election.

Yeah: The guy who said he could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and not lose any votes. That guy. Who wasn't elected absolute monarch, no matter what the unitary-executive crowd fondly believes.

Re: Elon Musk's Demolition Crew

#393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Musk at least is an agent of the guy who just won the election. Yeah: The guy who said he could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and not lose any votes. That guy. Who wasn't elected absolute monarch, no matter what the unitary-executive crowd fondly believes.

So you’re saying it was transparent what people were voting for?

Trump isn’t governing like a monarch. He’s not regulating private conduct or imposing taxes or putting people in prison. What he’s doing is exercising the executive power, as vested in him by Article II.

(As an aside, Article II says what it says. We don’t need a label for it. What requires a label is the theory that there’s an independent civil service insulated from the President and political appointees.)

Re: Elon Musk's Demolition Crew

#394
post #390
post #377

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if Trump hadn't amplified allegations of this community as illegal immigrants eating dogs and cats, would they have been harassed and threatened? Agree you're probably right. I never watched that debate, thanks for the clip. I won't watch it further I didn't like either one of them too much. I did like the remix though, I am sure there are plenty of more of those. But it seems that group is being sued and that's ho…

Don't bother joking with serial abusers of good faith on HN. They don't have a sense of irony. It's likely congenital.

[deleted]

Re: Elon Musk's Demolition Crew

#395
post #288
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The part of the constitution that says only Congress can create laws and the president just implements them.

He didn't create any law in this matter and he used a legal path way, executive orders. Do cry about the broken system.

No, he is closing down an agency using Executive Orders; however, as currently constituted, only Congress can shut down the agency.

> The Foreign Affairs Reform and Restructuring Act of 1998, 22 U.S.C. 6501 et seq.) established USAID as its own agency. In a section titled “Status of AID” (22 U.S.C. 6563) it states:

>> (a) In general

>> Unless abolished pursuant to the reorganization plan submitted under section 6601 of this title, and except as provided in section 6562 of this title, there is within the Executive branch of Government the United States Agency for International Development as an entity described in section 104 of title 5.

Because the agency is an independent agency, it cannot be interrupted without going through the appropriate channel.

[0] https://www.justsecurity.org/107267/can-president-dissolve-u...

Re: Elon Musk's Demolition Crew

#396
post #390
post #377

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if Trump hadn't amplified allegations of this community as illegal immigrants eating dogs and cats, would they have been harassed and threatened? Agree you're probably right. I never watched that debate, thanks for the clip. I won't watch it further I didn't like either one of them too much. I did like the remix though, I am sure there are plenty of more of those. But it seems that group is being sued and that's ho…

Don't bother joking with serial abusers of good faith on HN. They don't have a sense of irony. It's likely congenital.

Always helpful to review the guidelines. Thanks for the opportunity to do so [0]

> In Comments

> Be kind. Don't be snarky. Converse curiously; don't cross-examine. Edit out swipes

> Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive.

> When disagreeing, please reply to the argument instead of calling names. "That is idiotic; 1 + 1 is 2, not 3" can be shortened to "1 + 1 is 2, not 3."

> Please don't fulminate. Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community.

> Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith.

This isn't comprehensive, but it is enough to identify what you and I may take for granted from others in the community. If you feel I have abused good faith in my comments, I request you delineate what, exactly, you feel is not in good faith.

[0] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Elon Musk's Demolition Crew

#397
post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, the economist trends towards more factual reporting and less propaganda. Great call.

[flagged]

I find it hard to have a real conversation when a person apparently makes a sockpuppet account to express an opinion, complains when called out after they share information from a known propaganda source, then refers to a conversation nebulously as "scheduled programming".

Re: Elon Musk's Demolition Crew

#398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Musk at least is an agent of the guy who just won the election. Yeah: The guy who said he could shoot someone on Fifth Avenue and not lose any votes. That guy. Who wasn't elected absolute monarch, no matter what the unitary-executive crowd fondly believes.

So you’re saying it was transparent what people were voting for? Trump isn’t governing like a monarch. He’s not regulating private conduct or imposing taxes or putting people in prison. What he’s doing is exercising the executive power, as vested in him by Article II. (As an aside, Article II says what it says. We don’t need a label for it. What requires a label is the theory that there’s an independent civil service…

> What requires a label is the theory that there’s an independent civil service insulated from the President and political appointees.

The "executive power" is what's enumerated in Article II — most notably the All Other Officers Clause and the Take Care Clause. (It's been often said that it was no accident that the Framers put Article I first.)

So: If both houses of Congress pass a bill saying that Agency X is insulated from the president and political oversight — and the president signs the bill into law — then that should be the complete and utter end of the discussion until Congress and the president agree to change the law.

Those folks who've been bootstrapping a unitary-executive monarchy are engaging in ... let's just say, "creative lawyering" (spelled: making it up out of whole cloth). At least Marbury v. Madison has some policy grounds underlying it (the least dangerous branch and all that); the unitary-executive fantasy is devoid of such advantages.

BTW, just because Trump hasn't yet done all the things a monarchist could do, doesn't mean he's not a monarchist; saying otherwise is atrociously illogical.

Re: Elon Musk's Demolition Crew

#399
post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cite the regs. Cure what you feel is inaccurate.

This isn’t a serious request. The ability of authorities to grant arbitrary people access to classified information has been the law of the land forever. If you are unfamiliar with this then you are not in a position to make a credible argument. I am not going to play a game of “fetch a rock” with someone incapable of cursory research. This is my world, I know how it works.

Where you have made your claim isn't 'your world,' it's the open web. You may or may not spend any time at all, but taking people at their word was ruined by 4chan and other trolls.

Since I'm pretty sure you're wrong, and I actually chatted about my questions with people who operate in the space, let me add more information to the conversation.

First, governing documents:

Executive Order 13526 - Governs classification of national security information, including Top Secret, Secret, and Confidential levels. - Who Can Override? President - Override Process: The President can declassify or reclassify any classified information at will.

Classified Information Procedures Act (CIPA) - Controls handling of classified information in legal proceedings. - Who Can Override? Federal Courts (Judges) - Override Process: Judges can determine whether classified evidence can be disclosed in court.

National Industrial Security Program (NISP) (Executive Order 12829) - Regulates access to classified information by contractors and private entities. - Who Can Override? President, Defense Counterintelligence and Security Agency (DCSA) - Override Process: The President can issue waivers; DCSA can grant or deny access based on security clearances.

Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) - Regulates intelligence gathering on foreign entities and individuals. - Who Can Override? FISA Court (FISC) - Override Process: Judges can approve or disapprove classified surveillance requests.

Atomic Energy Act (AEA) of 1954 - Governs access to classified nuclear information ("Restricted Data"). - Who Can Override? President, Department of Energy (DOE), Congress - Override Process: The President and DOE can declassify certain nuclear information. Congress can pass legislation altering classification.

Presidential Records Act (PRA) of 1978 - Regulates access to presidential records, including classified materials. - Who Can Override? Incumbent President - Override Process: The sitting President can restrict or release prior administration records.

Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) - Allows public access to government records but exempts classified materials. - Who Can Override? Agencies, Courts, President - Override Process: Agencies can deny requests, courts can order disclosure, and the President can override agency decisions.

Department of Defense (DoD) Information Security Program (DoDM 5200.01) - Regulates access to military and defense-related classified information. - Who Can Override? Secretary of Defense, President - Override Process: The Secretary of Defense can restrict access within DoD, and the President can override classifications.

While a President could certainly grant access to classified (and sensitive) systems, there are still laws that prevent hostile takeovers like what Elon Musk and DOGE have done (which, you recall, were explicitly given access by executive order to unclassified systems).

The laws, acts, and regs I would have expected you to cite include:

- FISMA (2014)

- CISA (2015)

- EO 13800

- Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act (2004)

- CFAA (Title 18, USC Sec.1030)

Can the president override these restrictions? Not directly -- while the prez has authority over classified information and executive agencies, federal laws explicitly prohibit unauthorized access to IT systems, even by high-ranking officials such as DOGE. IT systems within agencies like the Treasury, OPM, and USAID operate under internal security policies and congressional oversight. A president attempting wholesale access to these systems without proper legal justification can lead to legal challenges (as it has), congressional investigations, and potential violations of federal law.

Some of the policies in these agencies, based on decades of experience in securing the systems, are

- DoD Instruction 8500.01 (Cybersecurity) - established RBAC and principle of least privillege

- DoD Instruction 8530.01 (Cybersecurity Activities Support to DoD Information Network Operations) -- monitoring of privileged users

- Army Regulation (AR) 25-2 (Army Cybersecurity) - MFA requirements -- Army specific, but similar regs at other agencies.

Now, what if someone with authority grants unauthorized access? You're talking espionage act now. CFAA too. Privacy act. Insider threat (EO 13587). Granting unauthorized access to federal IT systems, classified data, or sensitive records is a serious crime. If national security is compromised, penalties become even harsher under espionage laws.

Now, if you're actually in this world, I welcome your substantive additions to the conversation.

Re: Elon Musk's Demolition Crew

#400
post #396
post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't bother joking with serial abusers of good faith on HN. They don't have a sense of irony. It's likely congenital.

Always helpful to review the guidelines. Thanks for the opportunity to do so [0] > In Comments > Be kind. Don't be snarky. Converse curiously; don't cross-examine. Edit out swipes > Comments should get more thoughtful and substantive, not less, as a topic gets more divisive. > When disagreeing, please reply to the argument instead of calling names. "That is idiotic; 1 + 1 is 2, not 3" can be shortened to "1 + 1 is 2,…

tomrod, you're a serial abuser of the guidelines. You should take some time to think about what you say and do on HN and whether you are adding to the discourse are detracting from it. I think you could adjust your tone on almost all your political comments to be more thoughtful and less combative. It would be less work to point out cases where you observe the spirit of these guidelines than where you violate them. I'm sure you wouldn't wish to be so prejudiced, but you come across as an ideologue. Is that really who you want to be?
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