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Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

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Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#391

Post by theshrike79 »

pinkgolem wrote: post #337
indrora wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The person in this TikTok admits to having closed zero sales. They're also one of the most junior people on the team (4.5 months). You didn't listen to what they said: * One month at speed * Three months of ramp Generally, ramp time in roles like this persons would involve tailing and listening to active areas, training for the specifics of the product that you're selling, etc. We then hit December, wherein * Nobod…

> It's a dead month for sales. That depends, there are often left over budgets and people scrambling to spend them

But I'm not buying anything _new_ even if I have leftover budget, I can just buy more of the stuff I already have and use

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#392

Post by theshrike79 »

monero-xmr wrote: post #230
danpalmer wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have heard this criticism. I've also heard from my union that they know there is that image, and that's not a culture they support or want to create, and that they want to promote an effective and fair performance-based team environment. Fundamentally, a union for software engineers is just not going to work the same as a union for, say, manufacturing. There's a lot that mostly doesn't apply to us like physical saf…

Whistleblowing is an extreme edge case. What about simply a lazy non-performer? Can they still be fired? Is there just additional friction?

I live in a country where unions are a de-facto standard. They actually negotiate with the government for stuff.

Firing "lazy non-performers" is easy, you just follow the steps.

1) warning about performance, in written form with someone present 2) second warning 3) fired.

The American way where a boss can just come in and say "you're fired, gather your things and security will escort you out" will never fly here.

The process is there to make sure the reason for firing is explicitly stated and understood by both sides. It also gives some safeguards that just a personality conflict between people can't be used to fire someone, there has to be a proper reason beyond "I don't like your face"

Companies can also fire people when they hit a downturn, but there's a catch. If they claim it's for "economic reasons" (there's a specific turn of phrase they need to use here that doesn't translate) they then need to primarily re-hire the people who they fired if they start hiring for the same positions again.

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#393

Post by Dah00n »

outcoldman wrote: post #341
bamboozled wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are just doing their job as well. They are, but we could say similar things about cartels, drug smugglers etc.To you they're just criminals, to them, they're trying to survive and just doing their jobs. It doesn't mean it's a noble thing to be doing for a job.

I believe it is unfair to treat people in HR like that. To think about it, they got their job the same way we did (say engineers, or in case of the person on the video sales). I am sure some of them also got fired. More than that people who worked in HR went through hell during COVID and hire freeze. So yes, the job of HR is to hire and fire people. And of course doing some human resources things, but in reality prot…

>I believe it is unfair to treat people in HR like that.

If people do a job that is shitty to other people — including doing this zombie dance — they are absolutely part of the problem and should be called out for it.

>It is like being mad at the nurse/doctor at the hospital, that can tell you that she cannot do something for free, just because it is policy of the hospital.

If what the nurse cannot do is normal human decency, then yes, the nurse should be called out on it too and there's every reason to be mad at the person. You are using the “I'm just following orders” defence. It is a poor excuse and not a defence at all.

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#394

Post by Dah00n »

neilv wrote: post #86

I have personal wiki pages for companies, where I record things like interesting HN posts about them, notes about their products, and a log of recruiting interactions. All on one page. Were I to pull up this company's wiki page while talking with a recruiter, this video is like, on a first date, someone being rude to the waiter, while they smile at you. Strong signal about what they truly are. In this case, a stereot…

Great idea! You should add this too then:

https://twitter.com/TheTranscript_/status/165269146916406886...

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#395

Post by [deleted] »

justin66 wrote: post #248
c0nducktr wrote: post #205

Takeaway seems to be if you receive an invite from a rando HR person, decline that meeting. Edit: Also PR speak is one of the most unbecoming things I've heard in my life. I know there's HR people here in this thread, so to them: Try to at least act like your human.

Maybe if you combine that approach with hiding under your desk when anyone walks by, it will be literally impossible to fire you.

[deleted]

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#396

Post by [deleted] »

rockemsockem wrote: post #163
IvyMike wrote: post #25

I get why Brittany's mad: Cloudflare appears to be handling this about as bad as possible. But those two HR randos aren't gonna have anything worthwhile to say, either. I don't want to be judgmental of Brittany because it's a sucky call to have to take. But my recommendation in this situation is to say "I disagree with that assessment of my performance, but I understand you are terminating my employment. What details…

And what she's did is establish that they have nothing of worth to say and make them as uncomfortable as possible throughout the whole thing. Those both seem very worthwhile.

[deleted]

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#398

Post by epolanski »

aaomidi wrote: post #372
epolanski wrote: post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or maybe they did and she didn't tell in the TikToks? Don't believe everything you see on the internet. Be smarter than that, form opinions based on as many facts as possible, not only partial, biased, information.

I have more reason to believe this person than I do cloudflare.

Practice being skeptical.

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#399

Post by jiqiren »

_nalply wrote: post #246
r3trohack3r wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's extremely asymmetrical, too. I’ve lived a very different culture than you in the U.S. - to the degree I’m surprised to see you express this sentiment. In days of yore, people gave notice. But then a meme policy of “don’t poison the well” did the rounds. Roughly, the philosophy went: when someone is leaving they can only do harm; they are leaving, they have a convincing reason for leaving, and you don’t want th…

That's horrible and very different from what I experienced in Switzerland. It's a concept in Swiss law that obligations are symmetrical, and the periods are quite long (three months, and not only for employment, but for other contracts as well, like renting). If you are dismissed on the spot, you'll get three months of pay. On the other hand, if you give or are given notice, you are sometimes expected to continue wor…

It really depends on the company and why you are going. I gave 6months notice when I worked at Apple (FIRE) and slowly offloaded all my responsibilities. I documented many things for whoever would come in to replace me. They gave me a going away dinner and I still connect with former colleagues.

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#400

Post by op00to »

bmicraft wrote: post #359
RetpolineDrama wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>There are federal agencies you can file complaints with that will then tip off investigations and you can do that for free. More evidence that we need to dismantle much of the federal government, I don't want my tax dollars funding crap like this. The government should build bridges, highways, manage defense, control the border, manage trade policy etc. All of this extra stuff is scope creep to the extreme.

> worker protections are scope creep Never change, America

Most Americans do not believe that worker protections are scope creep.
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