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OpenAI board in discussions with Sam Altman to return as CEO

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Re: OpenAI board in discussions with Sam Altman to return as CEO

#391

Post by pembrook »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #54

You know, I always found Mike judge to probably be the most prescient of all of the science fiction authors. In Office Space, Idiocracy, and most relevant here in Silicon Valley; he accurately, and very precisely not only forecasts, but deconstructs the reasoning, and vapid lack of core philosophy behind each of the real life narratives he’s parodying. That serious people still consider Silicon Valley as some kind of…

This is such a weird take.

You do understand the whole point of silicon valley is the chaotic lack of maturity?

You cannot be staid and conservative and mature (and non-opportunistic)…and also be successful at creating new and interesting stuff.

If you find instability “horrifying,” might I suggest a job in banking or the federal government instead?

Re: OpenAI board in discussions with Sam Altman to return as CEO

#392

Post by extheat »

shmatt wrote: post #295
xianshou wrote: post #214

Whether you side with Sam or Ilya on rollout speed and approach to safety, the breathtaking incompetence of this coup has already incinerated a stunning amount of trust. One could hardly ask for a better demonstration that it matters not only what you do and why , but also how - above all, how you treat the ones who rely on you.

How is this a coup? The board is the CEOs boss. If that’s not true then they should have chosen a different corporate structure

There is a concept of a boardroom coup, which is what this was. The lack of decorum, the unceremonious and abrupt exit at the highest levels including removal of the chairman of the board, and the damning statement implying misconduct are very serious and substantial moves for any board to make, nevertheless one of the size of an org like OpenAI. They did not consult with investors, did not attempt to negotiate with the CEO/ask for a resignation, or anything of the sorts to resemble reasonable process. Usually you retain some form of legal counsel before making such a substantial move, but given the traditionally lax oversight non-profits, it doesn't seem like this is the case.

It's only at the abrupt all-hands meeting they called on a Friday night that it became clear that Ilya Sutskever was at the center of it. He had his disagreements, and pushed the board into making such a abrupt move, and then goes on to say something like "oh I agree it wasn't the ideal way to do it". It's very clear this was a power struggle, not maleficence (per words of OpenAI CTO), from Sam Altman. At least so far, it boils down to ... Ilya didn't like feeling sidelined, so he took things over. And now it's clear the board that sided with (or rubber stamped?) Ilya just wasn't prepared for the consequences.

Re: OpenAI board in discussions with Sam Altman to return as CEO

#393

Post by cowl »

ilaksh wrote: post #237

I am not sure it really makes sense for the investors to continue with OpenAI. It seems like this incident proved that the constitution of the company wasn't really compatible with a profit focus. It was a split from the beginning, and obviously a questionable arrangement. It just came to a head to make it obvious. The business and investment people want to make money. Many of the researchers want to take their time…

Especially since it's seems it's either Sam or Ilya. Now Sam might surely be preferred as CEO, but after the Anthropic Split, I think Ilya is even more crucial to the continuity of OpenAI. Many of the researches joined OpenAI for the "Open" part. Sure money attracts people but we saw that ideal attracted the best set of people and not money, or it would have been Microsft/Google/Apple who come up with GPT instead OpenAI. Yes i know that technically this is Google's research they are using but the execution. efficinces and tuning is what matters more in this case.

Re: OpenAI board in discussions with Sam Altman to return as CEO

#394

Post by sebzim4500 »

no_wizard wrote: post #382
woeirua wrote: post #319

If the reports are true, and Ilya led the coup, then either him or Sam can be at OpenAI going forward but not both. The rest of the board members who sided with him are gone either way. Regardless of who ends up at the helm, OpenAI is going to be a different place on Monday than it was on Thursday, and not for the better.

Not for the better why? Obviously Sam wasn’t the best fit for OpenAI and investors aren’t even saying what the problem is. Clearly the board feels he was the wrong person for the job. I think it’s ridiculous that everything thinks that Sam being outed means OpenAI is in trouble. Let this play out and see how it evolves

24 hours ago OpenAI fired their CEO in the most childish possible way. Now they are trying to get him back.

This is embarassing for OpenAI no matter how you slice it.

Re: OpenAI board in discussions with Sam Altman to return as CEO

#395

Post by wilg »

no_wizard wrote: post #382
woeirua wrote: post #319

If the reports are true, and Ilya led the coup, then either him or Sam can be at OpenAI going forward but not both. The rest of the board members who sided with him are gone either way. Regardless of who ends up at the helm, OpenAI is going to be a different place on Monday than it was on Thursday, and not for the better.

Not for the better why? Obviously Sam wasn’t the best fit for OpenAI and investors aren’t even saying what the problem is. Clearly the board feels he was the wrong person for the job. I think it’s ridiculous that everything thinks that Sam being outed means OpenAI is in trouble. Let this play out and see how it evolves

I think most people don’t think it was obvious Sam wasn’t the best fit for OpenAI.

Re: OpenAI board in discussions with Sam Altman to return as CEO

#396

Post by ivan_gammel »

spaceman_2020 wrote: post #331
eigenvalue wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are already the dumbest board in history (even dumber than Apple’s board firing Steve Jobs). So it’s not out of keeping with anything. Besides, those 2 independent board members (who couldn’t do fizz-buzz if their lives depended on it) won’t be staying long if Sam returns— nor are they likely to ever serve on any board ever again after their shenanigans.

Some of the board member choices are baffling. Like why is Joseph Gordon Levitt’s wife on the board? Her startup has under 10 employees and has a personal email address as the contact address on the homepage.

I guess you missed the part about Amal Clooney‘s husband at the Golden Globes. It’s 2023, why are we still referring people like that?

Re: OpenAI board in discussions with Sam Altman to return as CEO

#397

Post by no_wizard »

ilaksh wrote: post #237

I am not sure it really makes sense for the investors to continue with OpenAI. It seems like this incident proved that the constitution of the company wasn't really compatible with a profit focus. It was a split from the beginning, and obviously a questionable arrangement. It just came to a head to make it obvious. The business and investment people want to make money. Many of the researchers want to take their time…

Maybe. Or maybe they can profit differently going forward. Sam is not the reason OpenAI is gangbusters, its tech is. What I’m not hearing in any of this reporting is how Sam Altman is somehow the secret sauce.

And it’s because he isn’t. This is “rules for thee but not for me”. He as a bad fit, 2/3 the board outed him, and investors are mad because they didn’t feel included.

You know, like how they include employees in layoff decisions and not blind side them.

Sam Altman has spoken about “firing fast” when someone is a bad fit. he got fired fast, because he was a bad fit. That’s the seminal conclusion

Re: OpenAI board in discussions with Sam Altman to return as CEO

#398

Post by kelsey9876543 »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #124
steveBK123 wrote: post #85

Sutskever’s coup went about as well as Prigozhin‘s coup.

Yep. He's done. When you strike at the king, you must kill him. At a minimum it's going to be awkward in the men's room for a while.

This is the level of national security or foreign policy disaster. If you think anyone that was involved will ever work in tech again pass me whatever you're smoking

Re: OpenAI board in discussions with Sam Altman to return as CEO

#399

Post by dizzydes »

jessenaser wrote: post #366

Even though the country was against you, you should come back and lead it to freedom. If the entire board can be replaced, then Sam should come back. Even though he can build a new company tomorrow. A leader will come back to lead the best shot anyone has gotten in AI development so far. This was a power grab and it did not work. Not coming back is letting four people derail history and slow the development of AGI.

> A leader will come back to lead the best shot anyone has gotten in AI development so far.

What am I missing here? There's a handful of companies tweaking weights and optimising infrastructure usage. Won't LLMs naturally advance over time?

Re: OpenAI board in discussions with Sam Altman to return as CEO

#400

Post by tbrownaw »

skygazer wrote: post #26

Man, the board already looked reckless and incompetent, but this solidifies the appearance. You can do crazy ill-advised things, but if you unwaveringly commit, we’ll always wonder if you’re secretly a genius. But when you immediately backtrack, we’ll know you were a fool all along.

Option A: try to look good by hiding that you know you messed up

Option B: try to fix mistakes as quickly as possible

.

This is that thing that somehow got the label "psychological safety" attached to it. Hiding mistakes is bad because it means they don't get fixed (and so systems that (do or appear to) set personal interest in favor of hiding mistakes are also bad).

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