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Apple doesn’t want you developing hobby apps

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Re: Apple doesn’t want you developing hobby apps

#391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They also go out of their way to make it annoying to use applications that aren't signed by Apple under the $99/year developer plan.

Right-click open, click open one time ever is well below my personal threshold for annoying.

That's for signed apps. Totally unsigned apps can't be run without additional work.

Re: Apple doesn’t want you developing hobby apps

#392
post #165

I’m not defending this, but after 15 years, I don’t see the point in complaining. We complain (rightfully) about the amount of crap in the App Store and Apple's capricious review policies that don’t stop the scammers, but for better or worse, the $99 fee IS a barrier to entry that I would argue has made the iOS ecosystem better than Android. I’ve been paying $99 a year for early access to iOS betas and for my own tes…

[flagged]

> A "value" you cannot really describe nor measure, and that will leave you nothing once you stop paying or Apple goes away.

I think this is a strange and unfair criticism. I'll bet all of us, including you, can think of things that we value without being able to concretely describe why. We'd default to "because I like it".

That's not invalid at all.

Re: Apple doesn’t want you developing hobby apps

#393

My honest question is: What's the alternative. I'm not an apple fan. Most of my personal devices run Linux, but I feel essentially trapped on an iPhone. It doesn't seem like there's a truly useful open phone out there. I don't like Apple, and I don't trust them or their ostensibly pro-privacy stance much, but I want as little privacy invasion and as little advertising as possible on my phone, and I think as bad as Ap…

This is what I'll be doing. There are no smartphones on the market that I feel comfortable with trusting, even a little, so I'll be shifting to using a dumbphone instead, and also carrying a real, honest-to-goodness pocket computer that doesn't have a cell phone attached to it.

The phone will be used for exchanging calls and texts. The computer for everything else.

Re: Apple doesn’t want you developing hobby apps

#394

My honest question is: What's the alternative. I'm not an apple fan. Most of my personal devices run Linux, but I feel essentially trapped on an iPhone. It doesn't seem like there's a truly useful open phone out there. I don't like Apple, and I don't trust them or their ostensibly pro-privacy stance much, but I want as little privacy invasion and as little advertising as possible on my phone, and I think as bad as Ap…

> dual-wield and use a Linux or de-googled android phone for daily use and keep a second device around for the apps that won't run there I was thinking about this but what happens with on-the-spot payments? This seems like a functionality that's really convenient (not having to carry a bank card) but that would be on the official device, not the daily use device due to security issues. But paying for stuff in person…

> I was thinking about this but what happens with on-the-spot payments?

YMMV, but I don't (and won't) use my smartphone for this right now anyway. It's fine. Barely an inconvenience.

Re: Apple doesn’t want you developing hobby apps

#395
post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>But Jobs never lost his vision that Apple should sell appliances, and people who wanted to "wrench their own devices" should buy PCs. You present an excellent historical case of how Apple got here, but here's where I see a dichotomy: Back in the day, tools like RezEdit, Hypercard, AppleScript came included. There were countless "apps" to reconfigure how the Mac looked and felt to create a personalized experience. Av…

The Apple Macintosh was released in 1984. Jobs was pushed completely out of the company in 1985. When did RezEdit, Hypercard and AppleScript come out? Without looking it up, I would say after Jobs left Apple.

ResEdit: May 85

Jobs resigns: September 85

HyperCard: August 87

AppleScript: October 93

Re: Apple doesn’t want you developing hobby apps

#396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People've been saying this crap since I started using Macs over a decade ago. They're always sure Apple's on the brink of locking MacOS down into an appliance OS. They still haven't, haven't even made any big moves that way, but maybe eventually that crowd will be right in the same way that if you predict a recession every year, you'll eventually be right.

I'd argue that System Integrity Protection (SIP) on latest versions of macOS are that big move.

Why? Like similar things they've done, you can disable it. It's in the official docs, even.

Re: Apple doesn’t want you developing hobby apps

#397
post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can program iOS devices to do something new, but there are a few limitations on how that is made available. You can develop full blown iPhone and iPad apps right there on the device on an iPad using Swift Playgrounds. There are numerous third party development environments available that run on the iPhone and iPad, in languages like Python, Lua and Basic, some of which you can even publish to the App Store. I’ve…

I would call that 'somewhat programmable' at best, but certainly not 'highly' so.

You don't get full access down to the hardware level, but equally the contention that these aren't general purpose computing devices and aren't programmable is just tosh. They're far more programmable, in the sense you can learn a huge amount more about programming on them, than the home microcomputers I learned to program on as a kid.

Re: Apple doesn’t want you developing hobby apps

#398

I wrote an Android app for my little programming news aggregator, and published that on the Play Store because it was basically free (IIRC there might be a one-time signup fee). $99/yr is a ridiculous sum for the "privilege" of publishing in Apple's walled garden, and it's just not something I'm willing to do. The arguments for paying for review, distribution, advertising, search, etc feel so disingenuous when the co…

> $99/yr is a ridiculous sum for the "privilege" of publishing in Apple's walled garden It’s a token amount, just enough to prevent spammers from creating thousands of accounts. It’s $99 for your entire organization for a year. Go check what Microsoft charges for a Visual Studio license per seat, per year. $99 doesn’t even buy you 1 hour of a developer’s time. Even if you develop apps a a hobby, this is not a large a…

For a lot of people, including hobbyist programmers, $99 is actually quite a lot of money.

Re: Apple doesn’t want you developing hobby apps

#399
post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think what Apple’s afraid of is an app like Facebook tricking/forcing users to sideload in order to bypass privacy protections and get full access to user data. I don’t think they’re at all worried about hobbyists sideloading open source apps. Nah, they're worried someone might sideload a software with payment method that doesn't give them cut

Who wants another payment method? When something doesn't offer Apple Pay it's a huuugggee pain and a good reason to find something else.

The only thing simpler than a payment method is no payment method at all. A scary premise, judging from Apple's lethargic WebKit development.

Re: Apple doesn’t want you developing hobby apps

#400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> When I can't copy MY photos out of MY device, without uploading it to Apple's cloud. Wait, what? (Not an Apple user - genuinely curious)

They probably mean from an iOS device to a PC/Android. It can be done without using iCloud, but you’ll need a macOS machine or special iOS app to do it.

I’m fairly certain photos are the one thing you can get out of an iOS device with relative ease. They just present themselves as a USB storage device with a DCIM folder. Music, Videos, etc require specialized tool but photos are the exception.
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