> Our diagnosis is that individual developers do not pay for tools. I know this first hand, building a developer tool startup and failing to reach any level of revenue. In the end, the tech was bought out by a larger company to recover a fraction of our VC investment. The challenge is that when you're building software for developers, they already know how it must work. It's like trying to sell magic tricks to magici…
Yep. Sublime Text. I sat through scores of interviews and pairing sessions with developers back when Sublime was a thing and the vast majority (>90%) of devs would rather exit out of that pop-up asking for support then pay the measly $30 or whatever regardless of their massive incomes and increased productivity that Sublime brought them. We developers are no more altruistic than anyone else regardless of the lies we…
Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code
391–400 of 547 posts
Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code
#392Earlier quoted context omitted.
JetBrains is a czech company. And always was, as in "founded in Prague". Stop spreading FUD.
Could you point me to a couple videos of Czech JB devs talking at Czech conferences in Czech? Asking seriously. Because I was a russian speaking Ukrainian until recently and used to listen to tech podcasts and talks in russian all the time, for years, starting back when JB products just started gaining popularity. Not once was the company or it's products regarded as Czech by russians. It was always talked about as r…
[1]: Slide 35: https://resources.jetbrains.com/storage/products/jetbrains/d...
Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code
#393> Our diagnosis is that individual developers do not pay for tools. I know this first hand, building a developer tool startup and failing to reach any level of revenue. In the end, the tech was bought out by a larger company to recover a fraction of our VC investment. The challenge is that when you're building software for developers, they already know how it must work. It's like trying to sell magic tricks to magici…
Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code
#394Earlier quoted context omitted.
For TypeScript there's little difference since most of TypeScript support comes from the same language server running in the background (there's an option in the menus to restart it if it breaks, same as in vscode). Although autocomplete is better (especially for pure JS), it doesn't warrant paying for a license IMHO. Personally, I use IDEA for TS because I use it for other languages where it blows everything else ou…
Even if JetBrains does support your language more "natively", what makes it better than using a language server? As a student I can use JetBrains tools for free but personally, I'd much rather use something like VSCode combined with clangd than e.g. CLion, as I don't see anything that would make CLion better, while the JetBrains UI is downright cluttered. As for keyboard use, the command pallete (Ctrl+Shift+P) is rig…
— advanced refactoring for all supported languages: implement interface, extract interface, automatic "generification" for methods and classes, stuff like that. Saves quite a bit of manual typing.
— built-in database client (which I have already mentioned) which also provides autocompletion for database/table/column names, both for SQL queries, and various supported libraries like ORMs.
— navigation (jump to definition/declaration, find all references, etc.) works everywhere: any supported programming language, XML, files like JSON schema, YAML, you name it. For example, you can put the cursor to a primary key of a table, press your "find all references" shortcut, and it will show the list of all foreign keys referencing that primary key. Same with things like URLs on the client side (for example, the first argument to the browser's fetch() function) — put the cursor on the URL, press "jump to definition", and it will jump to the controller method that implements that URL, including the correct HTTP verb if there are multiple method for that URL. This is just one example, there are dozens of little things like that. All that makes it much easier to work with fullstack projects (to me at least).
— the UI and its "control interface" (so to speak) is consistent. For example, you use the same key combination to jump through search results, list of issues, list of references, etc. etc. Same for other key combinations — they jump make sense, you press what you think will work and it usually just works.
— it also supports fuzzy search everywhere, not just in the command palette. For example, you open up the list of databases, start typing in the name of the table (or database, or foreign key, or procedure, or whatever), and it highlights matching entries and lets you jump between them. Press Up and Down to go though its suggestions. The same mechanism works in filesystem tree, search results, issue list, and so on.
> JetBrains UI is downright cluttered
All of that can be hidden. I have the filesystem tree to the side, the main editor taking 90%+ of screen real estate, and the tab bar on the top, everything else is hidden behind a keypress.
> As for keyboard use, the command pallete (Ctrl+Shift+P) is right there and should be able to do anything
This is not the same at all. Everything can be done through keyboard shortcuts without typing in obscure commands (even though fuzzy search helps, it's pretty slow).
You should use what you think is convenient, I'm not forcing anyone. The more pressure you put on JetBrains by using the alternatives, the better for us.
Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code
#395Earlier quoted context omitted.
Because developers want to be able to hack on their own tools: fix bugs, add features, whatever. Graphics designers do not have the skills to hack on their own tools, so there isn't a huge population of them sitting around going "damn, I wish I had feature X -- I know, I'll build my own editor and open source it!"
Good god no, I just want it to work. I used to be that way, but you can be too in love with customizing your tools to the point that it gets in the way of doing your own projects. I do not want to spend all my time carving better knife handles. I think about writing my own IDE sometimes, but then I think how all-consuming such a project would be, and having to support a userbase made up of developers.
I do not either, but i do want to be able to fix a knife handle that is annoying me instead of being at the mercy of the knife manufacturer.
Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code
#396> Our diagnosis is that individual developers do not pay for tools. I know this first hand, building a developer tool startup and failing to reach any level of revenue. In the end, the tech was bought out by a larger company to recover a fraction of our VC investment. The challenge is that when you're building software for developers, they already know how it must work. It's like trying to sell magic tricks to magici…
I’m a web developer. My company pays for JetBrains IntelliJ for me. And I love it. But, if I had to pay for it out of my own pocket, I’d use VS Code instead. I’ve used both and IntelliJ is superior to VS Code, but not to such an extent that I would pay my own money for it. But I’m more than happy to have my company buy it for me.
Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code
#397> Our diagnosis is that individual developers do not pay for tools. I know this first hand, building a developer tool startup and failing to reach any level of revenue. In the end, the tech was bought out by a larger company to recover a fraction of our VC investment. The challenge is that when you're building software for developers, they already know how it must work. It's like trying to sell magic tricks to magici…
Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code
#398Earlier quoted context omitted.
For TypeScript there's little difference since most of TypeScript support comes from the same language server running in the background (there's an option in the menus to restart it if it breaks, same as in vscode). Although autocomplete is better (especially for pure JS), it doesn't warrant paying for a license IMHO. Personally, I use IDEA for TS because I use it for other languages where it blows everything else ou…
Even if JetBrains does support your language more "natively", what makes it better than using a language server? As a student I can use JetBrains tools for free but personally, I'd much rather use something like VSCode combined with clangd than e.g. CLion, as I don't see anything that would make CLion better, while the JetBrains UI is downright cluttered. As for keyboard use, the command pallete (Ctrl+Shift+P) is rig…
https://blog.jetbrains.com/idea/2022/05/take-part-in-the-new...
Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code
#399* Our diagnosis is that individual developers do not pay for OUR tool.
Re: Kite is saying farewell and open-sourcing its code
#400Earlier quoted context omitted.
I’m a web developer. My company pays for JetBrains IntelliJ for me. And I love it. But, if I had to pay for it out of my own pocket, I’d use VS Code instead. I’ve used both and IntelliJ is superior to VS Code, but not to such an extent that I would pay my own money for it. But I’m more than happy to have my company buy it for me.
It is very cheap compared to what developers usually earns.