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Nobody wants to teach anymore

jessicalexicus.medium.com

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Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#391
post #98

A few random thoughts: 1. For as much as we spend on education, teachers seem to be grossly underpaid - to be getting robbed of their share of the budget. Where does that money go? 2. It seems that education degrees are seen as easier to achieve than others. 3. Teachers frequently complain about how they are unappreciated, yet children spend _12 years_ in their care. Why do people come up to them and say they hated s…

1. Administrators. We have insane administrative bloat, especially in higher ed. In some institutions there is nearly a 1:1 count of administrators to faculty.

Ironically, given the social politics implied by the author, a significant amount of administration bloat is specifically tied to DEI.

2. Well, they are. A teaching certification used to only require two years of higher learning compared to typical 4 for other things. That said, most teachers are actually more highly educated than the average person because schools use educational attainment as direct basis for pay. My mother has a Master’s and is shy only a few hours and a dissertation from being a Ph.D. This was relatively common, especially for special ed teachers or those who focus on a specific subject like Math or English.

3. Partly because school in the US is boring and designed to grind out individuality in favor of making good industrial cogs. We no longer have an economy that rewards industrial cogs so students resent their school experience in adulthood as they discover how illy prepared they are for the world. That and parents/social fabric encourages and allows anti-social behavior and viewpoints.

4. Yes, and parents not giving a shit isn’t even a cause, it’s a symptom of larger and more intractable social and cultural problems in parts of America. Fixing this is nearly impossible because those most motivated to fix it are even more heavily motivated to ignore significant amounts of critical data about the causal factors.

5. Yes. Scaling is hard, and we’ve roughly tripled the population since we built the institutionalization of education in the US. It’s obvious a breakpoint exists somewhere and we failed to pivot.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#392

I am an early-retired EE and I thought that I could have a second career in teaching HS physics. I got the MA Teaching in Maryland, and did my one year student teaching assignment. My thoughts: 1. The degree program was decent, although a certificate program would be better for prior professionals if the law allowed it (lower cost, too much wasted time in redundant classes). 2. Teachers are sad. Very sad. They are un…

Sounds like there are two jobs here: babysitting, and teaching. Both are valuable, though likely that the former isn’t as difficult skill to master.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People might want to be teachers rather than software engineers because teachers get enormous amounts of time off, have extremely high levels of job security, plus all the usual reasons that not everyone is in the very highest paying profession. Why aren't you a hedge fund manager?

> teachers get enormous amounts of time off Anyone who's actually been or known a teacher knows this is false. During the school year, in the time they're not actively teaching, teachers are - Coaching sports - Overseeing other student extracurricular activities - Making/updating lesson plans - Presiding over detention - Tutoring students who need more 1:1 time - Serving on school committees (especially in larger dis…

> Making/updating lesson plans

Why? Are they really better than khan academy at doing a lesson plan? Isn’t this like a software engineer complaining they have to write their own database driver in their spare time after work?

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That many teacher’s pensions require one to give up social security benefits Patently untrue unless maybe you work for the Dept of Defense or something. Teachers can collect SS like any other employee.

There are many ways to compensate teachers [1], but in general, you really shouldn't make categorical statements on matters you are completely unfamiliar with. I help manage the finances of someone who is in the position of being unable to collect any social security benefits from the relatively brief time she had a regular job which paid into social security prior to becoming a teacher, and is also unable to collect…

I'm not above learning something. Texas seems to be district-dependent, and CA is statewide: https://www.trs.texas.gov/Pages/active_member_social_securit... https://www.calstrs.com/social-security

This is not the case for NY, and not in WI and PA as I have heard from teachers there.

In cases where they don't receive it though, they're not paying into it either. I can't comment as to whether that is a good or bad thing, because I don't know those cases. Maybe the union membership by in large doesn't want to?

For the benefit of others, I post this authoritative link from the USDOE: https://nces.ed.gov/programs/mapED/storymaps/TeacherSocialSe...

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, I guess it's all relative. I'm a software engineer at a startup. On average I work about 50-55 hours a week. I get 3 weeks of vacation a year. I certainly don't deny that teachers spend a lot of time working on their "time off". But that said, I've known more than a few teachers personally, and yes, they still do get enormous amounts of time off. Heck, a bunch of them will even admit it is the biggest perk of…

When I was teaching I worked a 7am to 6pm job, 5 days a week. That was actually in the school building, so that's 55 hours right there. The two hours in the morning and two hours in the afternoon, when I wasn't looking after 35 teenagers in a small, hot and unventilated classroom, were spent marking, planning lessons and writing reports. Have you ever had a job where you literally have to plan how much you drink, so…

I’m curious about what you’re doing now. I hope it’s healthier than what you described as your experience as a teacher.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#397
post #98

A few random thoughts: 1. For as much as we spend on education, teachers seem to be grossly underpaid - to be getting robbed of their share of the budget. Where does that money go? 2. It seems that education degrees are seen as easier to achieve than others. 3. Teachers frequently complain about how they are unappreciated, yet children spend _12 years_ in their care. Why do people come up to them and say they hated s…

> parents who frankly just don’t give a shit

They exist. What are you going to do with their children? Teachers are the people who have to answer that question.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#398
"old system in modern day doesn't work, in other news water is wet.". Teachers leave overwhelmingly because of the school office politics. Admins want things to stay the same forever, pushing classes that we don't need for people that don't want them.

High schools are prisons. Universities are scams. The good teachers recognize this and left. If we want to fix it, we need to wipe the system and create a new one that focuses upon what's necessary and not what ivy league people think is needed.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#399
post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 2. It seems that education degrees are seen as easier to achieve than others. Here is the problem. Teachers in America compare themselves to professionals, but their test scores are below the average for college educated people generally: https://www.brookings.edu/blog/brown-center-chalkboard/2017/... . Now 40% of college graduates don’t even get a job that requires a college degree. Disproportionately, those are p…

If we paid them more, it’d be easier to hold them to a higher standard

Teacher unions don't want higher standards.

Re: Nobody wants to teach anymore

#400

"old system in modern day doesn't work, in other news water is wet.". Teachers leave overwhelmingly because of the school office politics. Admins want things to stay the same forever, pushing classes that we don't need for people that don't want them. High schools are prisons. Universities are scams. The good teachers recognize this and left. If we want to fix it, we need to wipe the system and create a new one that…

There is a lot of room between "teachers have it really rough" and "high schools are prisons and we should blow it all up".
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