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YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

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Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#391
post #3

> YouTube indicated that examples of the offending content in the video included the line: “Most of the masks you get over the counter don’t work. They don’t prevent infection.” > It also included the quote: “Trying to shape human behavior isn’t the same as following the actual science which tells us that cloth masks don’t work.” Regardless of what you think about YouTube's misinformation policy, I don't think this i…

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Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#392
post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let them? First rule of internet is don't trust things on the Internet. Cross reference and double check. Everyone makes mistakes or lies.

How can you cross reference and double check if only one side is presented and the internet is the main means by which one double checks? This is the conundrum I haven't figured out.

> only one side is presented and the internet

Wait, only one side is presented ... on the internet? I must be misunderstanding you.

Unless you're being snarky, or referring to the Internet 'as controlled by google/youtube', and the fact that they're cancelling everyone that disagrees with them.

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's so much contradictory science on what you're claiming as ultimate truth. There's paper saying masks don't work there's paper saying masks do work. This is not a conclusive settled fact.

It's pretty conclusive. It's been conclusive for years and years, before COVID-19. There's no question at all that masks reduce infectiousness through the extremely obvious method of preventing some virus particles from going from one person to another, and also no question at all that probability of infection depends on number of virus particles around, and that viruses in general produce worse symptoms when the ini…

> It's been conclusive for years and years, before COVID-19.

March 2020:

U.S. health officials say Americans shouldn’t wear face masks to prevent coronavirus https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-cdc-says-americans-don...

In fact the U.S. surgeon general recently urged the public to “STOP BUYING MASKS!” “They are NOT effective in preventing general public from catching #Coronavirus, but if healthcare providers can’t get them to care for sick patients, it puts them and our communities at risk!,” wrote Surgeon General Jerome Adams on Twitter.

The CDC said last month it doesn’t recommend people use face masks, making the announcement on the same day that first case of person-to-person transmission of coronavirus was reported in the U.S. The CDC recommendation on masks stands, a spokesman told MarketWatch Wednesday, even with the first reported case of a COVID-19 infection in an individual in California who had not been to China or been exposed to a person diagnosed with the virus.

“The virus is not spreading in the general community,” Dr. Nancy Messonnier, director of the Center for the National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases, said in a Jan. 30 briefing. “We don’t routinely recommend the use of face masks by the public to prevent respiratory illness. And we certainly are not recommending that at this time for this new virus.”

WHO stands by recommendation to not wear masks if you are not sick or not caring for someone who is sick https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/30/world/coronavirus-who-masks-r...

“There is no specific evidence to suggest that the wearing of masks by the mass population has any potential benefit. In fact, there’s some evidence to suggest the opposite in the misuse of wearing a mask properly or fitting it properly,” Dr. Mike Ryan, executive director of the WHO health emergencies program, said at a media briefing in Geneva, Switzerland, on Monday.

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

YouTube is NOT the government. If Rand Paul was arrested for his speech, that would be a violation of his First Amendment rights and wrong. The right to speak does not compel a private platform to carry that speech. Certainly Fox News gives RP and his ilk plenty of opportunity to spread their harmful propaganda. So it's not like, even in a practical sense, his ability to express himself has been curtailed.

Lincoln was not even on the ballet In several states. That lead to a civil war.s We are reaching/past the point where open speech is no longer allowed. That makes next steps scary.

YouTube doing the right thing and banning some stupid misinformation is nowhere near civil war.

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#395

Easy fix for matters like this: citation. If you want to remove a video or other social media post, do so temporarily pending citation. Give people a way to back up their point of view with real data/research. If there is a conflict, put one of those warning banners beneath the video and link to the cited resource. Done. Otherwise, these companies look like oligarchs participating in low-key fascism.

The problem with this is there often is some shred of truth in any extreme claim that is pulled far out of context.

A better approach might be to leave it up but flag it and link to a page that explains what parts of the claim are true and which are misconstrued or embellished.

Social media excels at optimizing that one more engagement, leverage it here to lead people closer to the truth.

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#396
post #3

> YouTube indicated that examples of the offending content in the video included the line: “Most of the masks you get over the counter don’t work. They don’t prevent infection.” > It also included the quote: “Trying to shape human behavior isn’t the same as following the actual science which tells us that cloth masks don’t work.” Regardless of what you think about YouTube's misinformation policy, I don't think this i…

It is misinformation. Masks (cloth or otherwise) were meant to reduce infectiousness, not completely prevent the possibility of infection. Masks (cloth or otherwise) do in fact reduce infectiousness. The misinformation is the implication that masks are pointless because you can still get infected. The point of masks is to get the probability of spreading it down by some multiple, not to be a personal not-my-problem-a…

> Masks (cloth or otherwise) do in fact reduce infectiousness

This has never been proven. Please find me an RCT that shows this. I'll wait.

BTW, this is a doubly wrong statement for cloth masks, since cloth masks have plenty of studies showing increases in self-infection, at least relative to wearing a surgical mask.

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#397
I don't understand how people think that "controlling the narrative" is more overt now than in the past? In the past there wasn't even a Youtube, and if the local news in whatever-town didn't want to carry your point of view, you weren't getting any ink.

Argue all you want about if you approve of the policy, but let's stop acting like people not having unlimited access to megaphones is new or that we are in some sort of democratic crisis as a result. If you want access to someone's megaphone, you've always had to convince them to take you seriously. People perceived as arguing in bad faith can easily lose that - but even then, there is no lack of news networks or websites willing to give Rand Paul a platform still.

(I'd personally go further and argue for MORE slowing down of idea transmission. Bring back MORE of a cooldown and consideration period before you just regurgitate the last thing you read on Twitter.)

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#399
post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is unquestionably misinformation, and Rand Paul needs to have a permanent muzzle installed until covid is extinct. Masks DO WORK. Yes, N95s work better than cloth masks, usually, but cloth masks work very well for reducing the likelihood that a covid-positive person will transmit the virus. This isn't controversial. Rand Paul needs to stop spreading lies on purpose, and if he won't, I fully support YouTube telli…

I could be a novice in this subject matter so please correct me if I'm wrong but I think that a state board certified Ocular Immunologist with an active license to practice would know a lot more about masks than an Information Technology expert...which part did I miss? Are you letting your emotions get the best of you?

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Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#400

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every year, ~647,000 Americans die from heart disease alone. Even if the COVID death numbers aren't over-inflated, I guarantee you that if I were to time-travel to 2019 and ask you if you think that it would be worth precipitating a global supply chain disruption, missed schooling and medical appointments for children around the globe, both first and third world, and the greatest erosion in civil liberties in Western…

I, for one, wouldn't think that was crazy, no. Not when the preventability of those deaths is proportional to how well people stick to pandemic mitigation protocol. Very, very few people are willing to just shrug and say "600,000 preventable deaths is acceptable" in this context. The pandemic creates challenges that are uniquely tuned to impact the American "rugged individualism" approach to problem solving that work…

> "rugged individualism" approach to problem solving that works well in most circumstances.

I would love a source for this, because "rugged individualism" is the reason why US has the worst healthcare and homelessness of developed nations.

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