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MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

reuters.com

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Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#391

Post by forty »

tenaciousDaniel wrote: post #280
vbezhenar wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your view must be skewed by privilege of having stable currency. Currency of my country lost 250% of its value over last 7 years. It's not bitcoin-level volatile, but close to it. Thankfully I have an option to use USD to hoard money, but that option is not something that's given, in many countries you just can't exchange for fair price. I agree that for someone living in US or EU there's no much point using BTC.

It's sad that this aspect of the conversation so often gets replaced by everything else. This is (IMO) the most important point about digital currency - the promise of providing consumers in unstable economies the chance to convert to a more stable currency without government intrusion. We're still not there, but that should be the north star for crypto (again, in my opinion).

Why would someone give btc against a more risky local money? What I wonder is, why is it more convenient for someone who has some unstable money available to trade it for btc rather than euro directly for example? - i assume the end goal is to convert it back to a real money you can use to purchase thing?

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#392

Post by smartties »

red_trumpet wrote: post #363
whatshisface wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin's use as a way of bypassing currency controls is one of the best arguments against it, because governments, already prone to suspicion towards anything that might upset their monetary policy, will have no quarter towards anything that upsets their laws.

That's just not true. Every Bitcoin transaction is conserved in the blockchain, so a government can easily reconstruct the money flow.

And the transactions made on the exchange ? and decentralized exchange ? Can they all be tracked and reconstructed ?

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#393

Post by arcticbull »

DSingularity wrote: post #388
arcticbull wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People are buying TSLA because they want to do something about climate change. I hope given Tesla's new affinity with Bitcoin that what they want to do is "make it worse" lol. Tesla is literally selling its green energy credits to dirty car companies, then throwing it at Chinese coal miners. The market goes through particularly bubblicious periods of pricing mania from time to time. It's happening now, it's happene…

It will only revert if people sell. What if nobody sells because they equate selling with giving up on their dreams of fighting climate change?

Again, Tesla makes climate change worse by investing in Bitcoin so if climate change is the driver they should sell ASAP. I think you're overestimating the average speculator's love of the environment.

Yes, this time could be different. Past performance is not an indication of future performance. That said, it would be the first time something's gone parabolic upward (while lacking the fundamentals) without retracing, and I don't see any reason this time would be different.

[edit: Check this out: (1) https://imgur.com/a/HATGeWr (2) https://imgur.com/a/umQLsnK]

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#394

Post by jkepler »

vineyardmike wrote: post #344
spmurrayzzz wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is problematic for layer 1 settlement for sure. But there are layer 2 solutions that can help with the slippage issue (lightning network being the most prevalent). With a sufficient density of multisig wallet availability, as a proxy for liquidity, transactions are near-instant. That said, there are differences in settlement guarantees at layer 2 that might make certain use cases less optimal.

> for layer 1 settlement for sure. But there are layer 2 layers?

Sure. Layers, like the Internet is made up of protocol layers.

Bitcoin on-chain is layer one: slow, sure, and after 6 confirmations considered irreversible and immutable.

Layer 2 protocols would include the lightning network and the liquid bitcoin protocols - both systems designed for different use cases, with differing technological benefits and risks. There may be other layer 2 systems that I'm not aware of.

Some might consider the OpenBazaar marketplace protocol, the Open Timestamps (https://opentimestamps.org/) application, or the Bisq decentralized bitcoin/fiat exchange to be layer 2 applications, as they're built directly on top of bitcoin but includes protocols. But I think they're simple examples of the kinds of applications that can be built on top of the programmable trust-net that bitcoin represents.

Because bitcoin is a decentralized and permissionless technology protocol, anyone who thinks of a way to build on top of it can do so---without needing anyone else's permission.

Layer 3 might be applications built on top of layer 2, such as the censorship resistant Juggernaut chat app, built on top of the lightning network: https://www.getjuggernaut.com/. As layer 2 matures, I imagine we'll begin to see a wave of creativity unleashed globally as people create layer 3 applications.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#395

Post by jkepler »

throwaway1777 wrote: post #119
PretzelPirate wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My bank mainly issues Visa cards. I’ve had multiple cards throughout my life, and I’ve never had a master card before. I’d like to just add this feature to my existing cards that I already have set up for payments. Completely off topic: What I really want in life is: 1. If I could have a virtual credit card that could act as a proxy card and would let me use different cards based on the items I was purchasing (ex: if…

Settle down and have kids. Your problems will be solved.

Not necessarily if one works for a firm that moves you every few years. My family and I have lived in 5 cities in the past six years, due to changing work assignments.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#396

Post by nybble41 »

UncleOxidant wrote: post #340
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #2

These stories usually spur more enthusiasm for buying cryptocurrency, but ironically those buyers aren’t interested in spending cryptocurrency using their MasterCard. They’re hoping other people will buy cryptocurrency from these announcements, driving the price up. Or, more likely, they’re just hoping other people will buy cryptocurrency and not use it in these spending systems. Spending cryptocurrency would result…

> Spending cryptocurrency would result in selling that cryptocurrency, which would drive the price down. An economy based on BTC would be highly deflationary as no one would want to spend - why buy something today when it'll be cheaper in a week or a month? Scarcity isn't necessarily a good feature for a currency. Ideally supply of a currency should increase as more people enter the economy. Such a currency would aim…

> why buy something today when it'll be cheaper in a week or a month?

Because you need it today?

We already see this all the time in subsets of the market which experience deflating prices. If you wait a year to buy that fancy device you're wanting there will most likely be a better model available at a lower cost. People still buy the current model, though, because there is a cost to waiting which offsets the expected price deflation.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#397

Post by u678u »

sz4kerto wrote: post #300
cma wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did it lose more than 100% of its value?

I'm living in an EU-member country. Our currency has lost half of its value compared to the USD since 2008. How? 'Slowly and steadily.'

This is pretty misleading though, 2008 the USD tanked. GBPUSD and EURUSD were crazy high and currencies like RON, PLN had bigger swings, but if you look 20 years you can't say things have changed that much, esp with all the other changes in the world.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#398

Post by Triv888 »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #2

These stories usually spur more enthusiasm for buying cryptocurrency, but ironically those buyers aren’t interested in spending cryptocurrency using their MasterCard. They’re hoping other people will buy cryptocurrency from these announcements, driving the price up. Or, more likely, they’re just hoping other people will buy cryptocurrency and not use it in these spending systems. Spending cryptocurrency would result…

> Should also note that MasterCard crypto transactions almost certainly won’t be settled on the blockchain.

That is almost certainly wrong... otherwise, they could claim to have bitcoins and would not really need any?

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#399

Post by hammock »

rokhayakebe wrote: post #242
the_local_host wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The original idea of Bitcoin was to have a currency that wasn’t in government control I've never understood this. With an immutable ledger of all transactions, governments simply have to make it illegal to transact anonymously (or pseudonymously), watch the blockchain, and investigate any un-attributed transactions. It would actually enhance governments' surveillance capabilities against anyone not willing to run t…

governments simply have to make it illegal to transact anonymously Making something illegal does not give a government control over it. Many websites/apps are illegal in many countries. Yet governments have near zero control over their citizens using those products. VPN.

What is the VPN for bitcoin?
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