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macOS unable to open any non-Apple application

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Re: macOS unable to open any non-Apple application

#391

Post by ineedasername »

horsawlarway wrote: post #256
elmo2you wrote: post #202

Sincerely and without any intention to troll or be sarcastic: I'm puzzled that people are willing buy a computer/OS where (apparently) software can/will fail to launch if some central company server goes down. Maybe I'm just getting this wrong, because I can honestly not quite wrap my head around this. This is such a big no-go, from a systems design point of view. Even beyond unintentional glitches at Apple, just ima…

People chose to use Apple because it seems like a benevolent dictatorship. And frankly, a benevolent dictatorship is basically the best government you can have, as long as you're part of the "in-group" who doesn't push boundaries, doesn't cause trouble, and supports the supreme ruler, Kim jon... cough* Apple. --- The problem is that no matter how good the dictatorship might be today, it will eventually bite you. You…

In defense of Google, they really like having a lot of money.

Let P = "Don't be evil" and Q = "make lots of money".

Q was nothing new. They always wanted Q. But Google made a fundamental breakthrough in business logic, discovering that P -> ¬Q.

It should be noted that ¬P -> Q is not automatically implied. Plenty of companies are ¬P ∧ ¬Q. Perhaps they are not ¬P enough? Perhaps they are too much ¬P? But very few manage to be purely P ∧ Q.

Re: macOS unable to open any non-Apple application

#392

Post by jimmydorry »

GordonS wrote: post #240
auslegung wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> macOS is my favorite OS, but the shit I put up with... Idk, the several Linux distros I’ve used recently, and Windows, have a much longer list of “shit _I_ put up with”

Can you really think of a single thing worse than this?

Computer failing to turn on as a buggy, mandatory update has replaced broken or replaced a driver with a non-functional one.

Re: macOS unable to open any non-Apple application

#393

Post by Yetanfou »

outworlder wrote: post #351
jungletime wrote: post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is almost as bad as relying China on Personal Protective Equipment and quickly running out during the pandemic earlier this year. Imagine if the USA actually comes under an attack.The apple spaceship would be high on the list of targets. All of sudden hospitals can't run their computers or communications. Disaster!

Please stop fear mongering. If Apple servers actually go down, there's no issue.

That is why a smart attacker would not make them go down, instead they'd degrade performance to such an extent that it'd cripple Apple-encumbered products.

Re: macOS unable to open any non-Apple application

#394

Post by damnencryption »

babypuncher wrote: post #335
horsawlarway wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People chose to use Apple because it seems like a benevolent dictatorship. And frankly, a benevolent dictatorship is basically the best government you can have, as long as you're part of the "in-group" who doesn't push boundaries, doesn't cause trouble, and supports the supreme ruler, Kim jon... cough* Apple. --- The problem is that no matter how good the dictatorship might be today, it will eventually bite you. You…

I think the difference between the Google and Apple dictatorships is the business model. Google's customers are not the users, they are the advertisers who rely on the data harvested by Google. The incentive to be evil is directly baked into the business model, and most users end up tolerating it because it is "FREE", and often the only viable option. Apple's customers are the users. If Apple rocks the boat too much,…

> Making users upset is a direct threat to their business model

You can't really compare Google to Apple. You can switch to a different company if you don't like pixel phones and get almost the same experience. You can switch between manufacturers and use windows/Linux as well. The same isn't true about Mac os or iOS.

While you may think customers still have a choice, the reality is that they are locked in through their school, work or relationships (can't use imessage to talk to your spouse?). Apple makes it difficult to use third-party hardware and software it competes with so you will buy more and more Apple over time. People are prone to sunk cost fallacy and consistency. It's sales manual 101. I really can't recommend reading a good sales manual enough.

Re: macOS unable to open any non-Apple application

#395

Post by aptgetrekt »

nomel wrote: post #377
aptgetrekt wrote: post #371

There goes any temptation I had to buy an M1 Mac. Thanks for the warning Apple!

It's completely unrelated to M1 and also affecting Mojave and Catalina, apparently. It's a security signature check service problem. Some might argue that it should be easy to disable security signature checks, system wide (which is what the provided instruction achieve). Many more would probably argue that disabling these checks would be bad for security, especially for the average user. I'm curious what security re…

I know it's unrelated. I have a Mac and was unable to do any work for around an hour, had no idea why. Windows has smart screen, but if the service is unreachable you get a popup. This is just completely unacceptable, if it's possible that a server issue could cause all apps to fail locally, there should at least be a popup explaining that's why nothing is working. I'm fed up with far more than just this. I'm saying any temptation I had for an M1 Mac is now gone.

Re: macOS unable to open any non-Apple application

#396

Post by LinuxBender »

A temporary work around that helped me was to use

  sudo route add -net 17.253.17.207 255.255.255.255 -blackhole;
  sudo route add -net 17.253.17.202 255.255.255.255 -blackhole;
based on

  dig +short ocsp.apple.com |grep -E ^[1-9]
  17.253.17.207
  17.253.17.202
That shortens the delay. Others here found adding ocsp.apple.com to /etc/hosts using a private address also helps. Whichever is easiest for you. To remove:

  sudo route delete -net 17.253.17.207 255.255.255.255;
  sudo route delete -net 17.253.17.202 255.255.255.255;
or reboot.

Re: macOS unable to open any non-Apple application

#398

Post by laurent92 »

ineedasername wrote: post #365
elmo2you wrote: post #202

Sincerely and without any intention to troll or be sarcastic: I'm puzzled that people are willing buy a computer/OS where (apparently) software can/will fail to launch if some central company server goes down. Maybe I'm just getting this wrong, because I can honestly not quite wrap my head around this. This is such a big no-go, from a systems design point of view. Even beyond unintentional glitches at Apple, just ima…

In short, the vast majority of users never need or want fine-grained control over their computers. In the HN community, we are mostly edge cases in terms of computer usage & functionality requirements. I believe this is why there has never been any mass pushback against iOS/Android (even if Android is slightly better in this respect). Further, neither iOS nor Android (and now OS X) have instituted huge restrictive ch…

> fine-grained control over their computer

Or just run BlueStacks, which is necessary to run Among Us (the popular game since lockdown), which isn’t signed because it’s an emulator. And it requires the “Control this mac” permission. Unsigned. There are many, many cases in which users are faced with unsigned apps.

Re: macOS unable to open any non-Apple application

#399

Post by qayxc »

kinghajj wrote: post #330
qayxc wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It might get worse: now that they're switching to their own SoCs, they might even block APIs and allow access only to certified parties. Basically Final Cut Pro and Logic Pro might forever be faster than any 3rd party software package by having access to IP blocks that aren't exposed to other developers complete with signature check to prevent reverse-engineered use...

If they really tried that, wouldn't the DoJ bring an anti-trust case against them? That's exactly what Microsoft was doing in the 90s, using undocumented internal APIs for their own software that let it run faster than competitors'.

Well, unlike Microsoft in the 90s, Apple doesn't hold a monopoly in the PC space.

The current Oracle API-debacle also doesn't give me much hope that this would hold up in court. It's their hardware and by now they could even argue that Macs aren't general computing devices anymore. After all, what's the difference between the M1 and AMDs SoCs that power XBox and Playstation?

(I should be careful - I can always hear Apple's lawyers taking notes;)

Re: macOS unable to open any non-Apple application

#400

Post by kbenson »

tshaddox wrote: post #366
satisfaction wrote: post #341

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> rare, very long, simple in this context those are simply weasel words in my opinion

It's true that I don't have data on how often this type of problem happens, how long they last, and what the workarounds are, but I'm using those words not to be intentionally vague, but to reflect my own impression from my own experience, and I strongly suspect my impression matches most people's.

The problem is that this is not an issue that should be viewed only in the current context. Just because things are rare now, don't last very long doesn't mean that they will continue to be that way, or that it will work at all in the future if Apple decides that only EOL OSs could be using this system at some future point where it's mostly changed.

Not caring about this now is like not caring about government or corporate privacy invasions because "I have nothing to hide". It completely ignores all the variables that have to align to make this benign that happen to at this point, but are in now was assured for the future.

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